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How Apple's Obsession with Google Is Hurting Apple

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Re: How Apple's Obsession with Google Is Hurting Apple

#121

Post by Terretta »

kalleboo wrote: post #66
jaredonline wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thank you someone for bringing this up. I can't believe how many actual reviews (not just meme's poking fun at iOS6 maps) have missed this crucial point. This isn't about Apple trying to somehow hurt Google by rolling its own maps app, this is about Google not giving Apple full access to their maps.

The issue is nobody knows the truth here. I think the more plausible scenario is that Google wanted something that Apple refused to give (e.g., advertising revenue, user data, etc), making it not so clear cut as "It's XX's fault!"

Claim months ago was Google refused to license turn by turn. Reviews of Andriod 4 devices were extolling that feature. Apple needed it, had to build it. And it's frankly not that bad. I find it better than Google's, but notably worse than Navigon. Suspect most normals will be serendipitously surprised by the driving directions.

In recent weeks, I've seen the further claim Google was willing to license turn by turn but insisting on user location data for Latitude.

Re: How Apple's Obsession with Google Is Hurting Apple

#122

Post by Terretta »

kalleboo wrote: post #69
demallien wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A couple of points spring to mind: 1) public transit is not a very big advantage. It is useful only in the handful of US cities that have decent public transport. In Paris, one of the great public transport cities in the world, google still doesn't provide public transport information. In 2012. Apple's solution, to rely on 3rd party devs for this has every chance if providing a solution to iPhone users before Google.…

In my experience, Google Maps' Transit coverage is far far greater than "a handful of U.S. cities". It's worked everywhere I've been in Japan, in Singapore, Hong Kong, Sweden, London, Athens... The beauty of Google's Transit compared to apps maintained by the transit companies themselves is that it supports cross-company travel.

Not Paris, not Rome.

Re: How Apple's Obsession with Google Is Hurting Apple

#123

Post by Terretta »

DesaiAshu wrote: post #86
andreyf wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the old Maps app was perpetually stuck in 2007 while Android phones gained 3D views and (much more important) vector maps and turn by turn navigation I don't need or care about 3D view or vector maps or turn-by-turn navigation (although I see how the last one could be useful for a lot of users). I, like most city dwellers, need directions that take public transit into account. I can't believe Apple released an "upgra…

Both turn-by-turn and transit directions are available as 3rd party apps. Transit directions apps are free while turn-by-turn are fairly expensive (though I haven't checked recently). Despite having an iPhone I still have a GPS in my car, and since I started using iOS 6 in June turn-by-turn has become a staple of what I use the iPhone for. Apple is taking a short term hit in order to serve users better in the long te…

I agree with this. The blogs mocking 3D view (clearly a gimmick) or missing campus buildings are missing that Tom Tom turn by turn has an incredibly amount of real world knowledge and usability baked in for the larger market.

Re: How Apple's Obsession with Google Is Hurting Apple

#124

Post by Terretta »

josephcooney wrote: post #58
SoftwareMaven wrote: post #28

How do we know this is Apple trying to hurt Google? How do we know this isn't Google trying to hurt Apple? The fact that this sucks so bad for Apple's users and seems to be a net positive for Google would seem to indicate it is likely to be otherwise. The fact that Apple extolled the virtues of its map is immaterial. Of course they are going to do that.

How does google force Apple to ship broken software again? I've forgotten....

Let me remind you, then.

By shipping real time turn by tun nav for Android while keeping it out of the Maps app on iPhone.

Re: How Apple's Obsession with Google Is Hurting Apple

#125

Post by youngtaff »

fonosip wrote: post #62
redthrowaway wrote: post #3

The historical revisionism among the Appleistas is a bit disconcerting. This is not a matter of the "suits" overruling Jobs' "pirates". Apple's current anti-Google jihad is Jobs' baby. This is what he wanted. Now, it's entirely possible that he would never have authorized iOS shipping with a broken maps application, but to suggest that Apple's current direction is anything other than his idea and his impetus is naive…

Apple had no choice but to make its own maps. IOS5 already lacked turn by turn navigation because Google would not provide it (as a competitive advantage to android). So Apple building its own maps it's mandatory. Execution has been sub par so far. But Apple has always been sub-par at cloud services. They are improving but slowly

Yes but perhaps they could have released their own turn-by-turn navigation and left maps on there - just like Google have on my Android phone.

Of course they should have done this a long time ago really.

Re: How Apple's Obsession with Google Is Hurting Apple

#126

Post by youngtaff »

fonosip wrote: post #62
redthrowaway wrote: post #3

The historical revisionism among the Appleistas is a bit disconcerting. This is not a matter of the "suits" overruling Jobs' "pirates". Apple's current anti-Google jihad is Jobs' baby. This is what he wanted. Now, it's entirely possible that he would never have authorized iOS shipping with a broken maps application, but to suggest that Apple's current direction is anything other than his idea and his impetus is naive…

Apple had no choice but to make its own maps. IOS5 already lacked turn by turn navigation because Google would not provide it (as a competitive advantage to android). So Apple building its own maps it's mandatory. Execution has been sub par so far. But Apple has always been sub-par at cloud services. They are improving but slowly

I've also read that Apple didn't want to provide Google with the information that turn-by-turn feeds back.

But that was in TC comment so treat it with ta pinch of salt until verified elsewhere

Re: How Apple's Obsession with Google Is Hurting Apple

#127

Post by pooriaazimi »

hahainternet wrote: post #113
SoftwareMaven wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple is an incredibly secretive company. There were no indications the iPhone and iPad were on their way, either. Apple could have a dozen more products like that behind closed doors and we'd never know (until they start planting vague, conflicting rumors 6 months before release to start the anticipation media storm).

There were in fact lots of iPad rumours and I was mocked at the time for assuming they would introduce a tablet. Your memory is incorrect.

Very true. But remember, those rumors were steadily coming in for 4 years befor iPad introduction. But it got really worse in the last couple months, and that was when we were really sure there would be an iPad. Right now, we're sure about an iPad mini, but not about the TV thing.

Re: How Apple's Obsession with Google Is Hurting Apple

#128

Post by iamben »

bluedanieru wrote: post #109
chmars wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

iOS App Store URL? (There are no indications of a Google Maps app AFAIK but I also hope we will get one soon …)

There was an article on here yesterday that they'd submitted it to the store. I'm not following this too closely other than listening to folks at work bitch about it. (And on HN.)

Just rumour, apparently.

Link: http://appleinsider.com/articles/12/09/20/rumor_of_google_ma...

Re: How Apple's Obsession with Google Is Hurting Apple

#129

Post by tmh88j »

I agreed with everything up until the strange digression into Google+. I understand why he brought it up, but why go into irrelevant details about it?

While we're on the subject of G+...

>And more importantly, Google+ has a vastly superior user experience to Facebook

Really? Am I the only one who can't seem to figure out G+ at all? I use it almost daily for hangouts, but navigation is unbearable. The lack of labels and use of icons we're supposed to know is irritating. Good luck joining a hangout that's in progress unless you're invited.

G+ may appear to be more clean and chic on the surface, but when navigation and functionality are an issue none of that matters.

Re: How Apple's Obsession with Google Is Hurting Apple

#130

Post by MatthewPhillips »

joeblau wrote: post #23
warmwaffles wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google maps sucked when it first came out. It will be fixed and both applications will improve. I think this is will only turn out two awesome map applications rather than just relying on google for everything.

Really? I remember when I first used Google Maps coming from being a Map Quest user, I was blown away that I could scroll without having to refresh the page.

Also, one search box that intelligently knew these are all the same: "Illinois, Chicago", "Chicago Illinois", and even "Chi ill".
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