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Titan submersible’s $62 SanDisk memory card found undamaged at wreckage site

tomshardware.com

161–170 of 221 posts

Re: Titan submersible’s $62 SanDisk memory card found undamaged at wreckage site

#161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the encryption was that easy to bypass, was it worth it at all?

There are some reasons you'd want to encrypt even without a secret key. One is it makes it easier to erase data (just erase the key). It also makes bit flip errors a lot more obvious, which is another way of saying harder to ignore, so that can go either way.

Encryption does not make bit flips obivous, authenticated encryption would.

Re: Titan submersible’s $62 SanDisk memory card found undamaged at wreckage site

#162

If a hardened camera can survive, I'm surprised subs don't have a floating black box that can survive an implosion and then float to the surface and begin emitting a radio signal. I guess the trick would be finding a way to securely attach the black box in a way that would ensure its release in a catastrophic disaster.

There are a zillion applications for black-boxes, so why not start somewhere more accessible and with more impact? Your own house, car, and person, for instance. Think of how many elderly people die at home and nobody knows the details leading up to it. I'm being a bit facetious here - perhaps we don't need to know in those cases, nor in the Titan case. It's not as if there could be any data there which advances subm…

Just fyi - if your car has been manufactured in the last 10 years by a modern corporation(ie - not a Lada) it will have a black box already that records everything about the car's systems. They don't record sound from the cabin, but your speed, throttle position, movement of the steering wheel - it's all recorded.

Re: Titan submersible’s $62 SanDisk memory card found undamaged at wreckage site

#163
post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Usually (not always), something like a Teensy or a Pi Pico or an Arduino is treated like a development board for prototyping. A person builds out their circuit using hardware they can solder/wire-up by hand on a workbench, maybe even with relatively-giant solderless breadboards, to prove the concept and the general design. And a dev board can be great for spinning a few prototypes. It's quick to get started (code can…

Everything you said makes sense except you haven't explained why you can't just seal up a Teensy in an enclosure and sell it that way, except for "you're not supposed to do that". Are Teensies prone to random failure or something? Because if they just work and you're only selling <50 devices for extremely specialized nieche then I really don't see a problem with this?

(I previously wrote something rather crude. I am attempting to revise that into something more positive.)

In this context, all people are free to do whatever they want. It is beyond me to suggest that any person cannot do a thing.

Re: Titan submersible’s $62 SanDisk memory card found undamaged at wreckage site

#164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s my entire experience in embedded. Everything I get from other companies basically looks like an internship project right down to the pointer arguments with unspecified bounds on the function calls. One of the companies we bought hardware from keeps representing things are working when they only work on devices in the lab. Almost nobody in the space produces anything professional and everything uses Yocto even…

What kind of hardware projects do you work on? I'm mostly in the software space but in the past few years I've been doing a lot more embedded stuff, and the trend I notice is that companies are making great hardware, and then completely ruining its usefulness with bad software and firmware. It's kind of mind blowing to me because I always considered software to be the easy part of making a product, compared to, you k…

It's almost as if hardware was developed by actual engineers, unlike, you know, the other half of the pie.

Re: Titan submersible’s $62 SanDisk memory card found undamaged at wreckage site

#165
post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are some reasons you'd want to encrypt even without a secret key. One is it makes it easier to erase data (just erase the key). It also makes bit flip errors a lot more obvious, which is another way of saying harder to ignore, so that can go either way.

Encryption does not make bit flips obivous, authenticated encryption would.

A single bit flip would mess up the block, and hopefully the rest of the stream and the padding, no?

Re: Titan submersible’s $62 SanDisk memory card found undamaged at wreckage site

#166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah but the Camera's owner is much more likely to notice "my camera is missing" than "the SD card is blank for some reason... the SD card must have failed" EDIT: The linked PDF has a photo, the camera literally opens up to access the SD card.

Worth mentioning that I would immediately know if a different SD card was in my camera the moment I turned it on or ejected the card. If somebody knew to buy the same exact model and storage size that would be truly impressive.

Industrial espionage is far far more often done by hard work then being clever. Checking the SD cards you use and buying matching ones before executing a swap isn't noteworthy.

Re: Titan submersible’s $62 SanDisk memory card found undamaged at wreckage site

#167
post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Encryption does not make bit flips obivous, authenticated encryption would.

A single bit flip would mess up the block, and hopefully the rest of the stream and the padding, no?

Most unauthenticated encryption modes only mess up a few bits of a block, sometimes the following block too. A few only flip the exact bit in the plaintext.

Re: Titan submersible’s $62 SanDisk memory card found undamaged at wreckage site

#168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it depends. Encrypted filesystems typically encrypt contents of each file separately - that way you don't need to read / write the whole disk to read it write any individual file contents. Of course that means metadata may be in plain text or may be separately encrypted - again possibly folder by folder instead of all metadata at once. Exact details would vary with different file system encryption schemes. Wh…

> Encrypted filesystems typically encrypt contents of each file separately - that way you don't need to read / write the whole disk to read it write any individual file contents. Ah, that's not true of "full disk encryption". It usually encrypts the disk blocks. File-based encryption is stronger; you can use different protection classes on different files, you can use authenticated encryption, etc. iOS does it this w…

File-based encryption leaks metadata (which in some cases is bad enough to render it unusable).

Re: Titan submersible’s $62 SanDisk memory card found undamaged at wreckage site

#169
post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

0. They were too cheap to use an industrial grade SD. Mind boggling.

If you read the article, the SD card was placed there by the camera manufacturer and then the device was sealed so it would withstand pressure, and then sold to divers. Blame the camera manufacturer's engineers. Seems like the SD card of all things performed just fine, so it hardly seems like the weak point.

They are surprisingly resilient! There was a blog post a couple of years ago by someone who found a digital camera in the sea which must have been in the water for months. The author could look at the photos to see if they can find the original owner of the camera.

Re: Titan submersible’s $62 SanDisk memory card found undamaged at wreckage site

#170

I see a lot of discussion in this thread stemming from some confusion+not reading the actual report[0]. Some key points: 1. The Camera+Card was encased in a separate enclosure made of titanium+sapphire, and did not seem to be exposed to extreme pressures. 2. The encryption was done via a variant of LUKS/dm-crypt, with the key stored on the NVRAM of a chip (Edited; not in TrustZone). 3. The recovery was done by transp…

> 1. The Camera+Card was encased in a separate enclosure made of titanium+sapphire, and did not seem to be exposed to extreme pressures.

I wonder what the price of the enclosure was then. Feels a bit like click bait...

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