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German industrial output falls to 2005 levels as auto sector craters

ft.com

21–30 of 130 posts

Re: German industrial output falls to 2005 levels as auto sector craters

#21

Why is output falling? Are there other countries taking the market share? Or is there more to it?

Many reasons.

1) Ever since the Cold War ended, German companies have been shifting production to cheaper places in Europe, so less and less "German" cars are actually built in Germany and show up as German industrial production.

2) Germany used to sell a lot to China, but Chinese companies are upping their game and shifting to EVs, and Germany is losing Chinese market share as a result.

3) Those same Chinese companies are increasingly selling overseas and starting to kick German butt. I went to an EV car show recently, and while Volkswagen Group had a large presence (VW, Audi, Cupra, etc) and some of their EVs looked pretty good, the prices were consistently 20-50% above the equivalent Chinese models.

Re: German industrial output falls to 2005 levels as auto sector craters

#22

Why is output falling? Are there other countries taking the market share? Or is there more to it?

A lot of the industrial economy was based on cheap pipeline gas from Russia and there have been some issues with that policy recently

[flagged]

Re: German industrial output falls to 2005 levels as auto sector craters

#23

Why is output falling? Are there other countries taking the market share? Or is there more to it?

Article says:

> But a profit warning by German carmaker BMW late on Tuesday was the latest reminder of the industry’s structural challenges as it struggles with the transition to battery cars, weak sales in China and US import duties.

My gut feeling is that the Chinese are now buying locally made EVs. Other nations are buying Chinese made EVs. Except the Americans, who can't afford anything without paying extra money to their Mad King. (This is generalized, obviously there'll be American or Chinese BMW buyers, but a lot less).

Damn, look at that graph of registrations: https://carnewschina.com/2025/10/08/byd-sales-surged-2225-in...

Re: German industrial output falls to 2005 levels as auto sector craters

#24
post #4

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Liberal would mean it's on the car producers to get out of this situation again, but instead the government tries to comfort that industry and financially support them. What about that is liberal? Or maybe you mean something else than what most of the world interprets this word as: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberalism

It's the American duopoly in these peoples head man. If you're a Republican everything bad is "Liberal" and if you're a Democrat everything bad is "Conservative". Always quite entertaining when it is used as a measuring stick for policies developed in a multi-party democracy which does not fall along the party lines as cleanly as it does in the US. The fact that Merkel voted against gay marriage always seems to break brains.

Re: German industrial output falls to 2005 levels as auto sector craters

#26
post #4

[flagged]

> liberal agenda

It is quite the opposite of a liberal agenda. German policy is very illiberal in that it is heavy on bureaucracy, strict on regulations, and nowadays firmly stuck in a green-at-any-cost course. All that leads to high energy prices, sky-high barriers for industrial development and entrepreneurship and therefore high prices of german-produced goods.

Re: German industrial output falls to 2005 levels as auto sector craters

#27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A lot of the industrial economy was based on cheap pipeline gas from Russia and there have been some issues with that policy recently

[flagged]

You're totally forgetting Putin's imperialistic motives.

Proof: Finland and Sweden joined NATO and Putin didn't care.

Re: German industrial output falls to 2005 levels as auto sector craters

#28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Their public media broadcaster has ever increasing and absurd budget, these temporary bubbles are nothing in comparison.

Their _two_ public media broadcasters.

So now they are broadcasting TWO competing series about mountain doctor driving Mercedes and investigating that most rare disease?!

Re: German industrial output falls to 2005 levels as auto sector craters

#29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A lot of the industrial economy was based on cheap pipeline gas from Russia and there have been some issues with that policy recently

[flagged]

> but after multiple warnings and casus belli about Ukraine not flirting with NATO

Putin invaded in 2014 after Ukraine deposed of their dictator over his failure to commit to EU alignment, the Nato stuff is a post-hoc excuse developed by the Russian government. This isn't about Nato it's about Putin being afraid of having working democracies next door.

Re: German industrial output falls to 2005 levels as auto sector craters

#30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A lot of the industrial economy was based on cheap pipeline gas from Russia and there have been some issues with that policy recently

[flagged]

Lord Ismay, the first Secretary General of the North Atlantic Treaty Organization (NATO), reportedly observed that the purpose of the Alliance was to keep the Americans in Europe, the Russians out, and the Germans down.

https://www.nato.int/acad/conf/future95/rodman.htm

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