Daniel Kahneman opted for assisted suicide in Switzerland • Hacker News Board

Re: Daniel Kahneman opted for assisted suicide in Switzerland

#141

Post by dkga » Sat, Oct 11, 2025, 12:57 PM UTC

AQuantized wrote: post #92

lordnacho wrote: post #3

I had an old teacher who died almost a year ago. Great guy, very sociable, knew everyone in the little town he lived in. Kept in touch with a lot of students. Good neighbour, friendly guy who'd talk to everyone. He got Alzheimers. He started forgetting stuff, and it frustrated him. He got caught driving dangerously, and cursed the doctor who took away his license. He argued with me about the state of some chicken he…

> You really don't want to end up with dementia and related illnesses, it totally sours everyone's view of you. This seems like such an absurd conclusion to this, as though the opinions of other people of you are what matter when you functionally lose your personhood and then die. Maybe a better focus would be that there often isn't a good way for a community to manage a person who suddenly becomes irrational because…

This. Life is such a precious random occurrence that failing to protect it in the face [dementia|physical disabilities|etc] is the real tragedy.

Re: Daniel Kahneman opted for assisted suicide in Switzerland

#142

Post by ChrisMarshallNY » Sat, Oct 11, 2025, 12:58 PM UTC

mcdonje wrote: post #51

The sad demise of Robin Williams made me a believer of assisted suicide. The option to go out with dignity should be available to everyone. That said, there is a problem in at least some places where assisted suicide is available where it keeps getting recommended to disabled people who don't want to die. That needs to be solved. Seems like an easy solve. Just don't do it. There is a cost reduction incentive, though,…

I think that Hunter Thompson basically did this. Kinda "on-brand" for him, really.

I had a friend that decided to stop treatment (dialysis), when he realized that he'd never get off it (he couldn't get a transplant). He was in his late 60s.

It was both a sad, and joyous experience. He took about a month to pass (renal failure). He was Catholic, and wouldn't do assisted suicide.

During that month, a bunch of us would go over to his house, almost on a daily basis, and we'd just hang out. It was actually a great experience.

Re: Daniel Kahneman opted for assisted suicide in Switzerland

#143

Post by throwpoaster » Sat, Oct 11, 2025, 12:58 PM UTC

Assisted suicide is not how a healthy society should respond to serious mental health conditions.

Re: Daniel Kahneman opted for assisted suicide in Switzerland

#144

Post by raffael_de » Sat, Oct 11, 2025, 12:59 PM UTC

Freak_NL wrote: post #58

mcdonje wrote: post #51

The sad demise of Robin Williams made me a believer of assisted suicide. The option to go out with dignity should be available to everyone. That said, there is a problem in at least some places where assisted suicide is available where it keeps getting recommended to disabled people who don't want to die. That needs to be solved. Seems like an easy solve. Just don't do it. There is a cost reduction incentive, though,…

> That said, there is a problem in at least some places where assisted suicide is available where it keeps getting recommended to disabled people who don't want to die. Where? This is a thing which always pops up in these debates because it is a deep-rooted fear, but are there countries where this is a thing?

I'd argue that sadly something like this is bound to happen for sure because many (if not most) humans are lazy, greedy and don't like sick people outside of movies. If it is happening systematically and encouraged by the government or insurance companies - that's of course a different matter and has to be prevented.

Re: Daniel Kahneman opted for assisted suicide in Switzerland

#145

Post by dbZJtFuAXUrVLmY » Sat, Oct 11, 2025, 12:59 PM UTC

lordnacho wrote: post #3

I had an old teacher who died almost a year ago. Great guy, very sociable, knew everyone in the little town he lived in. Kept in touch with a lot of students. Good neighbour, friendly guy who'd talk to everyone. He got Alzheimers. He started forgetting stuff, and it frustrated him. He got caught driving dangerously, and cursed the doctor who took away his license. He argued with me about the state of some chicken he…

This comment really bothers me. I am not put off by the idea that the memory of a person is worth protecting, what I am put off by is the suggestion that death is a good option here, or that death is better than having lived those 3 years of life. The idea that when someone loses the capacity to retain their reputation and dignity it would be better for them and others that they were dead and that they have nothing good to offer is such a dangerous one and is just wrong. It applies to many people who are not near their end of life too. I am really pro assisted suicide as a way of shortening suffering when made as a conscious decision by people of sound mind, but comments like these make me very very uneasy.

Re: Daniel Kahneman opted for assisted suicide in Switzerland

#146

Post by rkomorn » Sat, Oct 11, 2025, 1:02 PM UTC

nicoburns wrote: post #140

rkomorn wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't necessarily agree with this take but I'd say it's probably because we're only willing to let people who are close to death "make a mistake." Eg maybe a 16 year old who wants to end their otherwise healthy life might, 20 years later, be glad they didn't. That seems less likely with someone who is almost certainly going to die (and probably painfully to boot) "soon".

> maybe a 16 year old who wants to end their otherwise healthy life might, 20 years later, be glad they didn't. Equally, they might spend decades of their life in misery wishing that they had been able to.

I don't particularly like this wording but can't seem to come up with another one right now:

I think it's okay for us to try and avoid the irreversible mistake, but yes, it's very arguable that living years you didn't want to live is also an "irreversible mistake".

Re: Daniel Kahneman opted for assisted suicide in Switzerland

#147

Post by hypeatei » Sat, Oct 11, 2025, 1:02 PM UTC

sarchertech wrote: post #110

hypeatei wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Between doctors, nurses and lawyers you can burn through a million bucks in five years easily That would indicate there is a financial incentive in keeping them alive , no? The "incentive" from the family's perspective, if they're that cold-blooded, doesn't make sense because they could just... not take care of that person.

You’re not understanding. They could just not take care of that person sure. But when the person dies, there will be nothing left to inherit because they will have spent it all on medical care.

So we've outlined a society where: healthcare providers, lawyers, etc. ("the system") stand to benefit from keeping a person alive and suffering because they can squeeze money out of them in their final years. Assisted suicide is being made available and "family pressure to commit suicide" is brought up as a concern? Sure, valid concern I guess, but it just seems pointless as there are already guardrails around these processes and we're not recognizing the benefits of giving more autonomy to people which means their suffering can be stopped.

Re: Daniel Kahneman opted for assisted suicide in Switzerland

#148

Post by stavros » Sat, Oct 11, 2025, 1:05 PM UTC

firesteelrain wrote: post #138

Freak_NL wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn't seem pleasant for the person themself either. Constant frustration, gaps in your memory growing ever larger, disorientation, loss — periodically augmented by brief flickers of recollection of what you used to be — and yet no one can legally end your misery, because you can likely no longer unequivocally consent to euthanasia or assisted suicide, even if you explicitly signed a declaration that you did not…

It’s still absurd despite what you say that we are implying that we should euthanize another human because they have become difficult to manage due to illness. Where do we draw the line?

I think the implication was more "people should be free, when they're of sound mind, to choose euthanasia if they lose that sound mind".

Re: Daniel Kahneman opted for assisted suicide in Switzerland

#149

Post by cwillu » Sat, Oct 11, 2025, 1:06 PM UTC

firesteelrain wrote: post #138

Freak_NL wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn't seem pleasant for the person themself either. Constant frustration, gaps in your memory growing ever larger, disorientation, loss — periodically augmented by brief flickers of recollection of what you used to be — and yet no one can legally end your misery, because you can likely no longer unequivocally consent to euthanasia or assisted suicide, even if you explicitly signed a declaration that you did not…

It’s still absurd despite what you say that we are implying that we should euthanize another human because they have become difficult to manage due to illness. Where do we draw the line?

You can quite easily draw a line that society does not get to force someone to live a tormented existence in spite of their prior declaration that they do not want to be tormented.

“It shouldn't be that way” is not an excuse to torture people through your moralizing indifference to the fact that it is that way.

Re: Daniel Kahneman opted for assisted suicide in Switzerland

#150

Post by locallost » Sat, Oct 11, 2025, 1:07 PM UTC

poszlem wrote: post #81

I’m trying to figure out why this feels so unsettling to me. I can understand wanting to end one’s life because of unbearable pain or illness, but something about this just feels wrong.

It's not unsettling for me, but I have a similar feeling. On the other hand, maybe he did have a medical issue, just chose not to disclose it. In any case it is his choice, as is the wish not to discuss it. I think this will be difficult to enforce, but I will personally respect it.