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Why are so many pedestrians killed by cars in the US?

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Re: Why are so many pedestrians killed by cars in the US?

#241

Post by 93po »

lastofthemojito wrote: post #237

What's the vehicle window tint situation outside of the US? Window tint is a pet peeve of mine - as a long-time small car driver I'm used to being around taller vehicles that I can't necessarily see through or around. But the situation has gotten worse and worse. The law hasn't changed AFAIK - there's a longstanding regulation that cars are generally not allowed to have dark tint from the factory but trucks, SUVs and…

ive had to resort to heavy tint myself literally just to not be blinded by headlights constantly. i know its not legal but ill take the ticket to not have my retinas seared every 10 seconds at night

Re: Why are so many pedestrians killed by cars in the US?

#242

Post by belorn »

ageitgey wrote: post #153
banga wrote: post #30

This morning while jogging in the US I came to an intersection. Green lights and walk on in my direction. A car approaching from my left had a red light, the driver glanced to his left and without stopping or looking in my direction, turned right across my path. I expected this of course, so avoided being run over. If I wasn't watching for this, it likely would be a different outcome. So why do so many pedestrians ge…

This is exactly why this turn is illegal in nearly every country in the world except the US and Canada. [1] If you are in the UK, this turn is illegal always and everywhere, so it basically never happens. I grew up in the US with right turn on red, so I was used to it and accepted it as normal. But after living the UK for 6 years, I'm now physically shocked when visiting the US at how dangerous it is to walk around e…

In Sweden you are not allowed to turn on red, but the crossroad on the right and left are often aligned to be green at the same time as the cars has green. As such, both the car lane and crossroads are active at the same time, and drivers are expected to turn across active crosswalks. Pedestrian has priority, and there is usually a short period between green -> yellow -> red, where the crosswalk will be red, which allow for around 2-3 cars to pass if the crossroad has people on them during the full active duration.

I think the major difference lies elsewhere. A major one could be that teaching drivers to ignore red is just a very bad idea. An other aspect I find quite different when I visited the states was that the transition time was extremely long compared to Sweden. Here it is not uncommon to see green to be only active for a handful cars worth of traffic before changing, or about the estimated time that it takes for a person to cross the road. It not designed to drive fast and do a quick turn.

Re: Why are so many pedestrians killed by cars in the US?

#243

Post by rstuart4133 »

banga wrote: post #30

This morning while jogging in the US I came to an intersection. Green lights and walk on in my direction. A car approaching from my left had a red light, the driver glanced to his left and without stopping or looking in my direction, turned right across my path. I expected this of course, so avoided being run over. If I wasn't watching for this, it likely would be a different outcome. So why do so many pedestrians ge…

> So why do so many pedestrians get killed in the US? The two main reasons to me are: 1. Drivers don't look for pedestrians, and 2. pedestrians expect drivers to follow rules.

You think that isn't the same everywhere? I've got some news: in every country there are parents distracted by kids fighting in the back seat, and in every country pedestrians walking into light poles while on the phone is a running joke. Also: the USA has managed to export it's love for large cars to most countries. Here in Australia we call large SUV's shopping trolleys.

Despite this, if you look at the graphs in the article, you will see most countries have managed to drive down pedestrian deaths. Except the US, where the curve trends up. The reason is pretty straight forward, and has nothing to do with the cars, the attitudes of drives or pedestrians. Hell, you can even ask an AI what it is, and you will get a reasonable answer:

    [Countries] have historically managed to drive down pedestrian deaths due to motor vehicle accidents primarily by adopting the Safe System approach, which includes elements of Vision Zero, a long-term goal of zero road fatalities and serious injuries.

    This approach focuses on creating a road system that is safe for all users, particularly vulnerable ones like pedestrians, by managing speed, designing safer infrastructure, and ensuring safe vehicles and road user behavior.
The AI drones on and on, listing the many changes to road design and rules that caused the drop. This is not rocket science. Everybody can do it, and it's trivial to find out what needs to be done. What the USA lacks is a political system that can deliver it.

Re: Why are so many pedestrians killed by cars in the US?

#244

Post by FridayoLeary »

IAmBroom wrote: post #198
FridayoLeary wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I heard the fire department wants wide lanes so they can drive around in those huge behemoths they love.

People living in buildings that are currently aflame tend to be fans of those behemoths. Speaking from experience.

In Europe they're smaller. I don't know if the fires are also smaller.

Re: Why are so many pedestrians killed by cars in the US?

#245

Post by Gigachad »

IAmBroom wrote: post #192
Gigachad wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some amount is likely cultural too.

Citation needed. Maybe, but maybe "some" is essentially zero.

Considering driving and road rules is entirely learned behavior that requires tens / a hundred hours of training before they let you do it unattended, it seems pretty reasonable that the environment you learned in plays a pretty big impact on how you drive.

Re: Why are so many pedestrians killed by cars in the US?

#246

Post by rudnevr »

having moved to us after 30 yrs of European experiences I would walk a lot in small and big East Cost cities. In the first year I was barely hit at least 3 times - once on the right turn with no lights (the driver only checked the left), once on the right turn red light (lack of my information so it's allowed in US), and once just when somebody went out of underground parking while talking to their phone. After that I learned never cross a road without making the eye contact with the upcoming driver.

Nevertheless, there had been a few episodes in the following years.

Re: Why are so many pedestrians killed by cars in the US?

#247

Post by pandaman »

estimator7292 wrote: post #157
Zambyte wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This comment makes it seem like people are built differently in the US than they are in the rest of the world, but that obviously isn't true. The roads (particularly intersections, where crashes tend to happen) are in fact built differently though. Urbanist resources like NotJustBikes and Oh The Urbanity! YouTube channels do a great job of highlighting the differences, and how they force drivers to pay attention thro…

No, the US has a culture of not giving a single shit about anyone but yourself. A frighteningly large fraction of drivers will do anything they can get away with. Here in the land of the free, rules are for other people, not for me.

Pedestrians are the same people: I often see a person nonchalantly crossing a six lane street in the middle of a block to get into a parked car on the other side. If someone decides to post on Instagram while driving at that time then it's another innocent pedestrian taken out by evil drivers but a few minutes later the same person could be posting on the Instagram while running over another.

I don't think it's a culture though, it's just people genuinely not being punished/rewarded for putting themselves in danger and avoiding danger when growing up.

Re: Why are so many pedestrians killed by cars in the US?

#248

Post by rkomorn »

rudnevr wrote: post #246

having moved to us after 30 yrs of European experiences I would walk a lot in small and big East Cost cities. In the first year I was barely hit at least 3 times - once on the right turn with no lights (the driver only checked the left), once on the right turn red light (lack of my information so it's allowed in US), and once just when somebody went out of underground parking while talking to their phone. After that…

I'm back in Europe after more than two decades in the US and I can't say I feel much safer as a pedestrian here.

Re: Why are so many pedestrians killed by cars in the US?

#249

Post by alterom »

paulcole wrote: post #228
alterom wrote: post #224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>People just don't value it as highly as they claim they do. Whatever. Change it to "city infrastructure heavily incentivizing people to drive everywhere by heavily penalizing all other modes of transportation and prioritizing automobiles and accommodating the needs of car drivers above everything else ". When the cities are designed for cars with everything else being an afterthought, people are going to driver ever…

> When the cities are designed for cars with everything else being an afterthought, people are going to driver everywhere. Not if they really hate driving and want to live differently! You can say you're a victim of circumstance or you can say I care a lot about something and have more control over your life. I'm biased because I'm 45 and have never driven a car in my life. I grew up in a very rural area in Florida,…

>You can say you're a victim of circumstance or you can say I care a lot about something and have more control over your life.

>I'm biased because I'm 45 and have never driven a car in my life.

I learned to drive when I was 24-25, after moving to Texas for graduate school, and cycling everywhere for a year.

I cycled ~3 miles for groceries.

I hauled an upright vacuum cleaner ~4 miles on a bicycle. And a bar stool.

You really can't blame me for not trying hard to avoid driving.

You can't blame me for, say, wanting to go to a movie theater, which was less than a mile away... by highway frontage, where cars would go 60mph.

You can't blame me for wanting to see places other than College Station, TX, when I was living there (despite the name, there isn't a station there, and hasn't been for the past 100 years or so).

And you can't blame for wanting to fucking live, after a good friend of mine was mauled down by an SUV when he, a non-driver, got out into the street in Long Island on roller blades.

Several were hit by cars while cycling (non-lethally, thankfully). At least one by a driver who was looking left (into the oncoming traffic) while making a right turn, and ignored what's literally in front of his car.

> then moved to Portland, OR because it was a decent place to live without a car.

My friend, not everyone has the choice to move to a handful of metro areas in the US where living without a car isn't a pain.

I'm glad you have the means and the resources.

I didn't, and still don't; Silicon Valley is where the jobs are for me. And it's not a great place to be at without a vehicle - and I say that even as I do use an e-bike for short runs.

After all is said and done, my quality of life has gone up tremendously after getting a car.

And that's why it's not a me-problem.

Re: Why are so many pedestrians killed by cars in the US?

#250

Post by notacoward »

tetraodonpuffer wrote: post #236
notacoward wrote: post #230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While it's true that this particular driver probably violated existing law, it's also true that this particular maneuver is inherently mistake-prone. The driver still has to look three ways - across the intersection (for left turners), at the crosswalk, and behind them for cyclists (or fast pedestrians). It's too easy to miss one while checking for another, even for a diligent driver following all laws. The statistic…

any time there is a right turn you can still end up in this same situation, whether it's right turn on red or not, if the driver does not look to their right: there have been plenty of times I have been nearly ran over when a car turning right on green did not notice that the same direction pedestrian crossing light was green also and I was about to cross. Same thing for cars turning right in front of me riding my bi…

If the light stays red while the "walk" sign is active (usually the case) it's a whole lot less likely that there will actually be a pedestrian there during the turn. There's also a bit more time (while waiting for the light) to see a bike approaching. Yes, all parties still violate the law and accidents can still happen, but they become less likely.

https://www.codot.gov/safety/shift-into-safe-news/2025/march...

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