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Aerocart cargo gliders

aerolane.com

51–60 of 112 posts

Re: Aerocart cargo gliders

#51

The iterated version where cargo can split off and land would maybe in some cases be interesting. A drone carrier.

I assumed this was about replacing "Airport 1 > Airport 2 > Industrial Park (trucks)" operations with airplanes which can drop cargo to multiple destinations.

Re: Aerocart cargo gliders

#53

"Despite the higher mass, takeoff & climb performance of the consist is similar to that of the lead plane flying independently. This means the consist is capable of taking off on the same runways and with similar climb profiles as the primary tow plane is alone." This is just denying basic physics. Ask any glider pilot how the climb out on aerotow varies based on the weight of the glider being towed.

Their current implementation (or prototype?) actually uses a powered airplane instead of a glider, which has its engines on for takeoff and then switches them off during the gliding phase (https://www.aerolane.com/aerocart, "How planes fly with AC0 today"). This way it works of course, but I'm not convinced it would be possible to take off with a glider in tow when the lead plane is already near its MTOW (if you'd have to reduce the loading of the lead plane to be able to accomodate the glider, that would defeat the whole purpose of what you're trying to do)?

Re: Aerocart cargo gliders

#54

Reference on their page to the (obvious inspiration) Waco gliders of WWII: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waco_CG-4

The military gliders made sense because they were landing in hostile territory, usually nowhere near a runway for a return trip. Those gliders were pretty much a one-way, one-time-use vehicle. I guess the Waco glider could be used to argue that towing is technically feasible, but it was intended for a totally different use case. I don't see how it can be argued that it's more economical to run, especially considering…

If you've got a bigger plane, you also need a bigger runway. This thing should increase the number of usable airfields. That could be interesting for avoiding more expensive routes.

Re: Aerocart cargo gliders

#55

This product is for towing behind another aircraft, but what about winch towing? A winched glider implements flight with renewable electricity and it does so efficiently because the power and motor never leave the ground! A glider can climb up to 5000 feet and travel 50x that before making a landing. Wouldn’t it be glorious to see cargo being autonomously slung from site to site across the world, powered entirely by…

I've done a few gliding flights. They were all towed to height by a powered aircraft and then released. Winch launch is an alternative to towing, but sounded like a fairly terrifying alternative where you were yoinked into the air by a huge winch. The terror isn't an issue if the glider is pilotless. But IIRC they used something like a 7 litre engine to winch an incredibly light glider. Presumably it would require something really powerful to launch a cargo glider.

Re: Aerocart cargo gliders

#57
post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not to mention, what happens in the event of damage to the towed aircraft rendering flight operations impaired such that it affects the towing aircraft? “Oh sh1t!” at 35K feet.

Better there than at 200 feet.

Unless "affecting the towing aircraft" means "ripping its tail off", in which case you're screwed no matter what height you're at. GA aircraft are probably a bit sturdier, but large cargo aircraft (based on large passenger aircraft) were simply not designed to pull anything, so I imagine you would need to add some kind of (pretty sturdy) reinforcement to the attachment point, which would mean extra costs and reduce the MTOW of the towing aircraft.

Re: Aerocart cargo gliders

#58
post #47
post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Glide ratio and weight are not related. Weight shifts the glide Polar to higher speeds and theoretically improves it slightly due to Reynolds effects.

"Weight doesn't affect glide ratio" is one of these things I learned why taking flying lessons that still feels counterintuitive every time I read it. (Don't worry, reader, I never intended to get a pilot's license.)

So, 2 gliders with identical geometry, one standard and one made of lead will have the same glide angle? That sounds unlikely.

Re: Aerocart cargo gliders

#59
post #41
post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> how much does it decrease the fuel economy of the towing plane Probably a lot, but I'd assume it is by less than the fuel that 1-2x more planes would use, otherwise there wouldn't be a point to doing this.

I did a masters on design a autopilot to optimize fuel consumption in formation flight. What is interesting about the aerodynamics is that if placed in the upwash wake of the leader, you are essentially increasing the wing aspect ratio of the system, resulting in gains for both the leader and the follower aircraft. Feels very unintuitive but basically the donut spool is larger and the combined wing is bigger in the s…

Apparently that is part of the reason geese fly in formation.

Re: Aerocart cargo gliders

#60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The military gliders made sense because they were landing in hostile territory, usually nowhere near a runway for a return trip. Those gliders were pretty much a one-way, one-time-use vehicle. I guess the Waco glider could be used to argue that towing is technically feasible, but it was intended for a totally different use case. I don't see how it can be argued that it's more economical to run, especially considering…

If you've got a bigger plane, you also need a bigger runway. This thing should increase the number of usable airfields. That could be interesting for avoiding more expensive routes.

If your plane+cargo glider weight is the same as your larger cargo plane weight, won't you need the same amount of runway?

Your towing plane is going to have to accelerate the same mass to takeoff speed before it can get off the ground, no?

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