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Find Nearby Automated License Plate Readers (ALPR)

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Re: Find Nearby Automated License Plate Readers (ALPR)

#11

Post by JumpCrisscross »

helterskelter wrote: post #2

If you don't want to take the risk destroying or spray painting the lense or solar panels of these devices, a picket sign installed right in front of it works pretty well while probably not getting you sent to jail. You may even be able to get away with ziptying a trashbag over it without too much fuss.

> You may even be able to get away with ziptying a trashbag over it without too much fuss

This isn't effective protest action unless you generate media that debates the downsides of the cameras. (If it just gets branded as vigilantism, you may wind up increasing support for them.)

Re: Find Nearby Automated License Plate Readers (ALPR)

#12

Post by JumpCrisscross »

NitpickLawyer wrote: post #8
littlestymaar wrote: post #7

One more reason to love GDPR: this kind of thing is illegal in the EU.

Not if the governments do it (strictly speaking, that'd be "data collected for the core functioning of the service").

It still looks like there are more data controls in the EU for ANPRs (number plate versus license plate) [1]. (EDIT: Nvm.)

[1] https://data.europa.eu/data/datasets/automatic-number-plate-...

Re: Find Nearby Automated License Plate Readers (ALPR)

#14

Post by beagle3 »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #12
NitpickLawyer wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not if the governments do it (strictly speaking, that'd be "data collected for the core functioning of the service").

It still looks like there are more data controls in the EU for ANPRs (number plate versus license plate) [1]. (EDIT: Nvm.) [1] https://data.europa.eu/data/datasets/automatic-number-plate-...

This is a list of datasets, not of restrictions, it seems?

When they say “ Information captured at the Roadside Automatic Number Plate Recognition system. Only vehicles matching specified criteria (e.g. expired test) are captured.” - meaning, that’s what in the dataset. But they have to read every plate to check its expiration status etc. they just don’t put it in this dataset.

But also … how is ANPR in Europe PII? Is there a public/semi-public database that connects plates to owners?

Re: Find Nearby Automated License Plate Readers (ALPR)

#15

Post by jahnu »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #11
helterskelter wrote: post #2

If you don't want to take the risk destroying or spray painting the lense or solar panels of these devices, a picket sign installed right in front of it works pretty well while probably not getting you sent to jail. You may even be able to get away with ziptying a trashbag over it without too much fuss.

> You may even be able to get away with ziptying a trashbag over it without too much fuss This isn't effective protest action unless you generate media that debates the downsides of the cameras. (If it just gets branded as vigilantism, you may wind up increasing support for them.)

This is excellent advice and a nice (theoretical at least) example of why protests and actions that don't necessarily "fix" an issue directly are important and not (necessarily) an ego trip for the protestors.

Re: Find Nearby Automated License Plate Readers (ALPR)

#16

Post by NitpickLawyer »

sleazebreeze wrote: post #13
littlestymaar wrote: post #7

One more reason to love GDPR: this kind of thing is illegal in the EU.

ANPRs are very popular and common in the EU. More so than in the US, even.

Yes, they are the key tech behind "average speed enforcement zones", where you get ticketed for speeding based on your "entry/exit" timestamps on a section of road.

Re: Find Nearby Automated License Plate Readers (ALPR)

#17

Post by JumpCrisscross »

jahnu wrote: post #15
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You may even be able to get away with ziptying a trashbag over it without too much fuss This isn't effective protest action unless you generate media that debates the downsides of the cameras. (If it just gets branded as vigilantism, you may wind up increasing support for them.)

This is excellent advice and a nice (theoretical at least) example of why protests and actions that don't necessarily "fix" an issue directly are important and not (necessarily) an ego trip for the protestors.

> why protests and actions that doesn't necessarily "fix" an issue directly are important and not (necessarily) an ego trip for the protestors

The point is to think through (and shape) the consequences.

Trash bag is nice but leaves interpretation to the viewer. Trash bag with a sign is better, but the ambiguity of the action together with the conciseness requirement of physical signage makes for a difficult combo. Trash bag with a QR code highlighting (depending on your town's partisan lean, of course) when "authorities in Texas performed a nationwide search of more than 83,000 automatic license plate reader (ALPR) cameras while looking for a woman who they said had a self-administered abortion, including cameras in states where abortion is legal such as Washington and Illinois" [1], or that Flock Safety "is building a product that will use people lookup tools, data brokers, and data breaches" [2] is better still. (Best would be something that concisely conveys the problem while blocking the sign. I'm not having anything readily come to mind...Lady Liberty holding her palm to the camera is kitsch.)

Still, just raising awareness is table stakes. Ideally such activity comes ahead of a petition drive, or town hall where a series of plants raise objections to the company.

[1] https://www.404media.co/a-texas-cop-searched-license-plate-c...

[2] https://www.404media.co/license-plate-reader-company-flock-i...

Re: Find Nearby Automated License Plate Readers (ALPR)

#18

Post by heroprotagonist »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #4

What we need is a leak of a Flock database. Ideally, due to a security fuck-up by someone other than the jurisdiction that installed them. (Company itself, or another city doing Flock's warrantless search feature.) Having granular location data for an entire town's license plates should still be creepy and damaging enough that it gets these things torn out and replaced with something more thoughtfully designed. (Side…

That didn't work for cellular location data, it probably won't work for license plate readers.

Re: Find Nearby Automated License Plate Readers (ALPR)

#19

Post by [deleted] »

beagle3 wrote: post #14
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It still looks like there are more data controls in the EU for ANPRs (number plate versus license plate) [1]. (EDIT: Nvm.) [1] https://data.europa.eu/data/datasets/automatic-number-plate-...

This is a list of datasets, not of restrictions, it seems? When they say “ Information captured at the Roadside Automatic Number Plate Recognition system. Only vehicles matching specified criteria (e.g. expired test) are captured.” - meaning, that’s what in the dataset. But they have to read every plate to check its expiration status etc. they just don’t put it in this dataset. But also … how is ANPR in Europe PII? I…

[deleted]

Re: Find Nearby Automated License Plate Readers (ALPR)

#20

Post by reify »

Here in the UK we also have London's congestion charge.

All around the outskirts of London on all the main arterial roads, there are ANPR cameras tracking number plates to fine you, if you have not paid the £15 charge for entering the city.

A worrying example of ANPR.

I visited my mum one weekend, she lives over 300 miles from where I live on the egde of London.

She had a phone call while I was there from the police. They were asking to speak to me!

They said that they were concerned that there were two cars with the same registration number plate. Could I check that my car was still outside my mums home.

They had stopped another car, not the same make as mine, in London with the same number plate. The police said that the other car had been involved in criminal activity.

I can only assume that they tracked my car over 300 miles with ANPR, checked out who I was, then did a family association check, found my mum's contact details and called to speak to me.

I also assume that they must have already been to my home address and found I was not home.

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