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Germany outfitted half a million balconies with solar panels
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Re: Germany outfitted half a million balconies with solar panels
#232That’s the thing about statistics - it is only somehow valid at some uncertain date. I know 3 not registered installations. One guy has big photovoltaic installation and installed balcony power plant to cover his special energy needs at sunrise. Another guy works from home and has two balcony power plants to cover his home office needs. Third guy didn’t like batshit crazy registration website and left the installation unregistered, but running.
Re: Germany outfitted half a million balconies with solar panels
#233Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yes, but where do you live?
Well, the person you are replying to is in a thread about Germany, mentions balcony solar and said "my little server turns it automatically on" (which is how you would construct that sentence in German instead of "turns it on automatically"), so my wild guess would be Germany. ;)
Germany isn't that big, but the difference between Freiburg and Hamburg is very significant in this case I believe
Re: Germany outfitted half a million balconies with solar panels
#234Earlier quoted context omitted.
I don’t understand this sentiment at all. They didn’t sacrifice their balcony, and this is electricity that the central utility organizations couldn’t generate. Many parts of the world don’t even allow this kind of solar panel to be used by individuals, so its legality is actually a policy success. Generally, balcony panels are hung off the side of the railing, so no space was lost. If this was blocking out windows o…
> I don’t understand this sentiment at all. They didn’t sacrifice their balcony, and this is electricity that the central utility organizations couldn’t generate. Many parts of the world don’t even allow this kind of solar panel to be used by individuals, so its legality is actually a policy success. Completely disagree. This is definitely electricity that central utility organizations could generate. A central metho…
This being Germany, you actually are supposed to register every panel in a central database. So the utilities know where generation is happening. This is for proper solar installs as well as for balcony solar.
I have a proper setup on my roof, and installed a 2kW balcony setup (2kWp panels mixed with an inverter limited to 800W) at my in-laws place.
Both are registered in the central database. I got a new power meter for mine. But it seems my in-laws are to keep their old power meter for a while, which occasionally just turns backwards, whenever they produce more than they consume.
Re: Germany outfitted half a million balconies with solar panels
#235Earlier quoted context omitted.
This is a ridiculous take. Germany did not screw up their energy policy, they had a transition plan that ended up not working due to one of the partners in that plan starting a war and believing that they had Germany by the short hairs to stop them from interfering. For individuals in Europe that have the possibility to spend a few hundred (or even a few thousand) bucks up front to lower their energy bill is a win fo…
Well, Germany made an assumption that their „partner”, which already was starting wars, would at least keep them far enough from their home turf. It backfired spectacularly and we can blame German government for that. Not much to disagree about generating energy at home though.
Yes they thought that dependence would be codependence and make Russia less willing to start wars etc.
Re: Germany outfitted half a million balconies with solar panels
#236Earlier quoted context omitted.
I don’t understand this sentiment at all. They didn’t sacrifice their balcony, and this is electricity that the central utility organizations couldn’t generate. Many parts of the world don’t even allow this kind of solar panel to be used by individuals, so its legality is actually a policy success. Generally, balcony panels are hung off the side of the railing, so no space was lost. If this was blocking out windows o…
People often forget that installation costs dwarf panel and battery costs at this point. A gizmo that had 3kwh of battery (and a fan) sitting behind a well matched solar panel would sell like hotcakes, especially if it supported daisy chaining and back feeding into the grid (with safety interlocks for power outages).
The thing about balcony solar is that there are no 3rd party costs. Just the time you need to install it on your own.
I mean, you could pay someone to do it for you, but most people will be able to do it on their own.
Re: Germany outfitted half a million balconies with solar panels
#237Re: Germany outfitted half a million balconies with solar panels
#238> Germany outfitted half a million balconies with solar panels
A more fitting title would be "Germany's citizens outfitted half a million balconies with solar panels". The current phrasing makes it sound like it's somehow a thing done by the government, which is not the case. If anything the government is one of the many forces slowing down this progress. And yes, I am aware of things like grid security and stability being a concern. I am not complaining.
Re: Germany outfitted half a million balconies with solar panels
#239Has anyone done any studies on the co2 emission of manufacturing one panel like this? Curious how long it will take to offset.
585 kWh/m^2 median energy consumption for production according to a 2013 study cited on the Wikipedia article on energy return on investment. 440 W panel has about 2 m^2. It is probably a tad better now, because lower mass of silicon per meter squared. That translates to roughly 2.5 years of energy payback time in Germany under good conditions (azimuth SE to SW and elevation about 30 to 60 degrees, no shadow). Give a…
> If windmills are shut down around noon to make room for PV, the offset is zero.
Very important point that is often ignored.
Re: Germany outfitted half a million balconies with solar panels
#240Earlier quoted context omitted.
It takes literally two hours to install and plug it in if you have two left hands like me.
Plus the time getting the material, driving to the hardware store another time to get something you forgot, doing the registration, plus the time needed for planning/ calculation of economical feasibility/ decision making. Even at a very moderate 50 € per hour rate (for the typical Gamer) the material cost is the smallest part of the project. Treat it as a hobby, but don’t tell me it is an investment.
As with many things, the hardware store is probably going to be rather expensive and transport is a hassle (most people do not have a car with enough space to transport solar panels). So you order this stuff from specialized companies who will deliver it to your doorstep in one more or less convenient shipment. Same for pretty much any bigger, more expensive things needed when building or extending a house. Hardware stores are convenient if you quickly need something but that's mostly it, IMO.