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Personal data storage is an idea whose time has come

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Re: Personal data storage is an idea whose time has come

#61

Post by xandrius »

InMice wrote: post #26

Among the first page and 2nd page (top 60) there is always atleast 1 post about how we're gonnna "take back the web" or make it back into some form of our 90s millenial nostalgia memories, self hosting, federated this or that, etc etc. Meanwhile - Nothing changes, everything generally gets worse and younger generations come into the world with no memories of the 90s internet or the world before mobile devices or surv…

If even the people who experience a different time gives up because "nothing changes" then it's truly over.

We need to do what we preach: sure, things are worse in certain things but for sure setting up a local network with top-level open source self-hosted alternatives is the easiest it has ever been ever.

Also I think people forget to realise that the type of people who were online in the 90s are still online, many still does exactly the same things. The Internet just got so much easier to use for the rest of the people who doesn't really see the magic of it all. And that's ok.

People always complaining how bad things currently are, they are doing a disservice to all the services and communities still around. They are not sexy or cool but they exist.

Re: Personal data storage is an idea whose time has come

#62

Post by tomrod »

jstummbillig wrote: post #48
InMice wrote: post #26

Among the first page and 2nd page (top 60) there is always atleast 1 post about how we're gonnna "take back the web" or make it back into some form of our 90s millenial nostalgia memories, self hosting, federated this or that, etc etc. Meanwhile - Nothing changes, everything generally gets worse and younger generations come into the world with no memories of the 90s internet or the world before mobile devices or surv…

Nothing changes because the ask is silly and disconnected from the reality of normal people's lives. So what happens if Google has all your data? To the best of my observations over the past 20 years: best in class services, cheap, paired with excellent security and data availability.

Look at QC Safe sometime. Same idea applies. Incentives are not consistent over time.

Giving all your data for better services is easily hijackable.

Re: Personal data storage is an idea whose time has come

#63

Post by aprilfoo »

InMice wrote: post #26

Among the first page and 2nd page (top 60) there is always atleast 1 post about how we're gonnna "take back the web" or make it back into some form of our 90s millenial nostalgia memories, self hosting, federated this or that, etc etc. Meanwhile - Nothing changes, everything generally gets worse and younger generations come into the world with no memories of the 90s internet or the world before mobile devices or surv…

I think it's about showing that different models are possible for people who do care and are willing to reflect and change the way they operate.

The big majority goes with the comfort of the mainstream, almost by definition.

Re: Personal data storage is an idea whose time has come

#64

Post by carefulfungi »

jstummbillig wrote: post #48
InMice wrote: post #26

Among the first page and 2nd page (top 60) there is always atleast 1 post about how we're gonnna "take back the web" or make it back into some form of our 90s millenial nostalgia memories, self hosting, federated this or that, etc etc. Meanwhile - Nothing changes, everything generally gets worse and younger generations come into the world with no memories of the 90s internet or the world before mobile devices or surv…

Nothing changes because the ask is silly and disconnected from the reality of normal people's lives. So what happens if Google has all your data? To the best of my observations over the past 20 years: best in class services, cheap, paired with excellent security and data availability.

Exactly. "It's good for you and takes some effort" is a bad growth strategy. For this movement to win, something will have to replace social media and walled gardens with a better dopamine hit, that just happens to keep data private.

Re: Personal data storage is an idea whose time has come

#65

Post by tomrod »

bluebarbet wrote: post #52
nkrisc wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Stop viewing them in isolation and view them as a product of their environment. They weren't born with a phone in hand, someone gave it to them and someone created Tik Tok for them.

That's a fair argument. It's also unfalsifiable and based on an underlying personal worldview. Specifically (I would venture) an "us and them" view of things where history is determined by groups and power - a left-wing outlook, basically! I'm a bit of a liberal individualist by nature, I see personal responsibility and autonomy as a thing. I'm not sure how I'd go about deprogramming myself of this even if I wanted t…

Ticktoks and Phones do not exist without a creator. Buck stops with the software dev and exec.

Re: Personal data storage is an idea whose time has come

#66

Post by cwmoore »

ffsm8 wrote: post #46
erlend_sh wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is demonstrably not fantasy as the example case is a fully productionized network (Bluesky and the rest of AT-net) that’s having real-world impact to the point where it’s under threat from several authoritarian states.

It has? Don't get me wrong, I'm in the tech industry and generally more online then likely 95% of the population, but ime ... Nobody even knows what bluesky is? (They also don't know what X is, though they DO know what Twitter is) And even more niche products like mostodon, the fediverse altogether etc are entirely unknown to most of the tech industry too.

Sounds like a feature. I like some self-selection bias, it might have character. Maybe a little less global competition for my attention.

Re: Personal data storage is an idea whose time has come

#67

Post by nsndndkddk »

diggan wrote: post #13
seu wrote: post #6

The fact that the AT Protocol relies on everyone having a domain name, which is a centralized system over which few people have control, and about whose workings most people have no clue about, is problematic. Also impractical, once we consider that - as far as I can understand - 8 billion people should have their own domain name.

> The fact that the AT Protocol relies on everyone having a domain name Well, either that or someone else hosting their identity (see did:plc), which seems to be the part you say should exist? Probably DNS is the most decentralized centralized system we have available today that most people can actually use, unless I'm missing some obviously better way of doing the same thing?

The thing your missing is ICANN is headquartered in the US. The US political situation is dire and I think this could be a real danger for the internet at large. We might end up with disagreeing DNS worldwide at some point. E.g. if you hold a domain and have a non-authorized viewpoint so your DNS entry gets snuffed.

But from a practical point of view a decentralised system should not rely on domain name ownership. Any computer can generate a private/public key pair, which is all you need for identify.

Re: Personal data storage is an idea whose time has come

#68

Post by anonbuddy »

crazygringo wrote: post #47
anonbuddy wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

current data points are much more valuable than historical data points, so storing old data doesn't have much incentives also by having ability to enable/disable access to your data, you have the power of who gets what and for which purpose also reselling of your data should become illegal to start with, would you be OKAY if your lawyer sells your data? or your colorectal surgeon? off course not, we have laws in plac…

> current data points are much more valuable than historical data points, so storing old data doesn't have much incentives Not true -- advertising profiles are vastly more valuable when based on a lifetime of data. > also by having ability to enable/disable access to your data, you have the power of who gets what But realistically, when are you ever going to disable access? If you want people to be able to read your…

I agree that this is not just a technological problem to be solved. Technology by it self can't fix the problems, but it can help nudge the human experience in good or bad way. Right now, we gave our data to large corporations and we got the lovely attention economy thats being feed on human rage, envy and greed.

Solid idea is more in line with revolution and demand for our representatives to give their people internet that can push the humanity forward, and not just let us waist countless hours on doom scrolling.

Re: Personal data storage is an idea whose time has come

#69

Post by diggan »

nsndndkddk wrote: post #67
diggan wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The fact that the AT Protocol relies on everyone having a domain name Well, either that or someone else hosting their identity (see did:plc), which seems to be the part you say should exist? Probably DNS is the most decentralized centralized system we have available today that most people can actually use, unless I'm missing some obviously better way of doing the same thing?

The thing your missing is ICANN is headquartered in the US. The US political situation is dire and I think this could be a real danger for the internet at large. We might end up with disagreeing DNS worldwide at some point. E.g. if you hold a domain and have a non-authorized viewpoint so your DNS entry gets snuffed. But from a practical point of view a decentralised system should not rely on domain name ownership. An…

> Any computer can generate a private/public key pair, which is all you need for identify.

Right, but once you've generated those, then what? You need a global registry of sorts so people can lookup each others keys for example, which is why DNS kind of is the best we have available today.

I don't think there is any perfect solution here, but it's hard to come up with something that has better trade-offs than DNS. Sure, ICANN might be based in the US, but so far DNS been relatively safe to rely on, and if ends up not reliable in the future, I'm not sure social media profiles is the biggest worry at that point.

Re: Personal data storage is an idea whose time has come

#70

Post by 9dev »

nubinetwork wrote: post #32
9dev wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It wasn’t the companies but the users that found it easier. There’s a reason why everyone’s on Facebook, instagram, and gmail instead of running their own hosts—because it’s vastly easier for the majority of people to do so, and because everyone else is there. We have not solved decentralisation in an accessible and useful way yet, and the incentives won’t change until we do. If ever.

God forbid that people actually have to learn and do something instead of sitting around being a doomscrolling tiktok zombie... /s

Not that I disagree with you, but that’s generally not how society works. If only everyone had some consideration, self-control, and curiosity, we wouldn’t have an environmental crisis, churches, corruption, or wars. Yet all of these things do exist and won’t go away no matter how I wish them to.

So the next best thing is trying to operate in the constraints that apply, such as most people being unwilling to learn new things and going down the path of least resistance.

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