Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized

cnn.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

481–490 of 1001 posts

Re: How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized

#481

Post by mrguyorama »

nielsbot wrote: post #168
myth_drannon wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

The Israelis (and their suppliers) are the ones with the power to end it. They have chosen this. There are actually other avenues you know. This is entirely on them.

>The Israelis (and their suppliers) are the ones with the power to end it

Israel cannot unilaterally end hostilities any more than Hamas can.

Peace requires two willing parties.

Israeli people need to remove Bibi the genocider and be willing to concede land and leave Palestine alone

Palestinians need to be willing to evict and eliminate Hamas, run the country in a non oppressive way, and leave Israel alone

Israel can end the genocide it is perpetrating, and then accept more death in a few years when Hamas feels like doing more marketing (which, fyi, is the point of their terrorism: Fundraising). Is that desirable or useful?

Please show me where Hamas has signaled in any way that they would leave Israel alone if Israel completely left Palestine alone. Right now neither side can even manage a token ceasefire. There's no trust, and there's no accountability.

The real question is this: How many dead people are either side willing to accept to work towards lasting peace?

Lasting peace, a solution to the Palestinian horror, requires people willing to give up legitimate grievances from the past. Are Palestinians willing to move on from half of their children starving to death? Lots of Israeli people were willing to protest their own government before October 7th to agitate for less Palestinian oppression. Hamas targeted some of those young adults for that.

Re: How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized

#482

Post by Humorist2290 »

So focusing on the details of the situation in Gaza is quite awful. The general tone of the comments in this thread, along with basically any public forum I think speaks for the reverberation of human suffering throughout this -- civilians are being made into casualties, Israeli and Palestinian, and it's terrible.

Taking a broader perspective, large parts of the human race have come to realize famine is a relic of the past. Modern agriculture, synthetic fertilizer, and the technology of the last 100+ years has made famine optional. There is without a doubt the technological capacity to supply every person on earth with food and clean water. Nobody needs to go hungry to feed every person in Gaza. The same could be said of Sudan, or Bangladesh, or Haiti.

200 years ago, famine was usually a natural disaster; now it is almost exclusively a political choice.

Re: How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized

#483

Post by ipaddr »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #417
phgn wrote: post #405

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The UN calls it a genocide now. What evidence more do you need?

> UN calls it a genocide now One, really important to specify that the Independent International Commission of Inquiry on the Occupied Palestinian Territory, including East Jerusalem, and Israel said this, not the UN as a whole. "The UN" is generally held to be the General Assembly. Two, I'm not disputing that it probably is a genocide. I'm just saying that people have been calling it a genocide well before we had ev…

It was called a genocide early on because of the disregard for civilian life but it doesn't become one until everyone dies. The more accurate term is war crimes.

At this point public opinion matters less than existing relationships.

Re: How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized

#484

Post by danielbenzvi1 »

ipaddr wrote: post #475
sys32768 wrote: post #450

[flagged]

Benjamin Netanyahu funded Hamas in the 90s. So this is where we are. If they allowed the PLO to manage we would have two states already.

The idea that simply empowering the PLO would have produced peace ignores the reality of what happened when they were empowered. After Oslo, Israel handed over cities in the West Bank and gave the Palestinian Authority control in Gaza. Instead of building the foundations of a peaceful state, the PLO leadership became riddled with corruption, failed to create functioning institutions, and tolerated or even encouraged waves of violence. The Second Intifada, launched under the PLO’s watch, was one of the bloodiest chapters in the conflict and shattered Israeli trust in their willingness or ability to deliver peace.

Re: How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized

#486

Post by glenngillen »

softwaredoug wrote: post #479

I've heard it said by eliminating all other avenues of Palestinian political expression, Netanyahu created modern Hamas. He undermined the two-state solution and Palestinian Authority. When you do this, you back people into a corner. There's no path to peacefully making progress on anything you care about. It also conveniently gives Netanyahu a boogeyman for his own political ends. You might argue the PA was corrupt,…

The most recent episode of John Oliver goes further and says he actively funded Hamas to destabilise the area and cause problems for the PA.

Re: How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized

#487

Post by onetimeusename »

There are articles about Israel planning for Gazans to emigrate for months. The idea is they would 'voluntarily' emigrate to several African countries Israel made deals with. So I think that is more proof the starvation is deliberate. They can claim they aren't forcing anyone to migrate but if you stay you die. Not only is that evil but they are forcing some other country to deal with the problem.

Re: How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized

#488

Post by ASalazarMX »

HDThoreaun wrote: post #462
chollida1 wrote: post #235

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't believe I'm weighing in on a political thread, but the "deal" is very one sided. It offers very little for the Palestinians in terms of creating their own country and ability to self govern and gives Israel pretty much everything they want including some control over Palestine. The current "peace deal" is terrible for the Palestinians. No other country would sign it either.

Well the palestinians shouldnt have launched a terrorist attack if they wanted a good deal. Now their choices are bad deal or genocide

How could Palestine launch an attack if it wasn't a state? It was Hamas, right? It's a war against Hamas, not a grab for territory, right?

Re: How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized

#489

Post by jijijijij »

axython wrote: post #260

For anyone commenting on this, I'll leave this: Official aid delivery reported by UN. I'd also assume this to be of the lower side, as there probably is more that doesn't get reported thorugh UN 27720 mechanism. I find the fact that this article does not use this or point to this data very questionable, but maybe I am wrong and I am imagining things. https://app.un2720.org/tracking

> Intercepted - Either peacefully by hungry people or forcefully by armed actors, during transit in Gaza

I presume you meant to suggest Hamas is bathing in baby formula, but your link isn't evidence for that. It could be desperate people doing desperate things, you know, because they are starving.

Re: How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized

#490

Post by tguvot »

jacobgorm wrote: post #277
dataflow wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The claim I've heard them make is that the food aid is making it in, but being stolen by Hamas so that it can be resold at markup. How do you convince people that believe this that it isn't true (or is irrelevant)?

See this Tucker Carlson interview with a former US special forces colonel who worked distributing aid in Gaza https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=QRjEMbHXM4Q

the one that was fired for misconduct, begged to get his job back and threatened that he will become their nightmare in case they don't rehire him ? sounds very reliable.

https://ghf.org/press-briefing-ghf-addresses-personnel-matte...

Post reply on HN