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Britain to introduce compulsory digital ID for workers

reuters.com

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Re: Britain to introduce compulsory digital ID for workers

#291

Post by netdevphoenix »

voidUpdate wrote: post #273
netdevphoenix wrote: post #267

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Missing the point. A passport is the universal identity document. It's way too valuable to carry around and expediting a new passport is costly and slow. Checks need to be done in person and the passport holder needs to be told in advance about the check (so impromptu checks don't work and expired passports get through, also catching fake passports and the like is hard). A digital ID as its name says is digital, chec…

The government has been able to do checks on me using my passport number etc, like when I was getting my provisional driving license, so somewhere there is a digital version of it on a government server or something. Can't they just make that information available? What impromptu checks would you need this ID for? The use cases I've seen for it are to make sure you are legal to work, and when renting a house, both of…

That is not what I mean. Doing checks using your passport number is not good enough . It only proves that you someone used your passport number for a job. It doesn't prove it's you. It doesn't prove that you didn't swap with someone else (worker proxy). A digital id is a token fully controlled that opens compliance possibilities that are not possible or financially feasible by using just a passport number because the government does not control the passport numbers of everyone (especially those for which this policy is intended).

Think: the ability to verify that the id owner's face resembles the face of the id holder. The ability to check that the id owner address matches that of the id holder. The ability to flag employers containing id owner employees regularly failing those checks. The ability to do this regularly without previous notice to the id owner at national scale remotely or in person is a level of compliance you will never get even halfway with just using a passport number.

Re: Britain to introduce compulsory digital ID for workers

#292

Post by somelamer567 »

billyjobob wrote: post #279
netdevphoenix wrote: post #267

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Missing the point. A passport is the universal identity document. It's way too valuable to carry around and expediting a new passport is costly and slow. Checks need to be done in person and the passport holder needs to be told in advance about the check (so impromptu checks don't work and expired passports get through, also catching fake passports and the like is hard). A digital ID as its name says is digital, chec…

The fact that the UK doesn’t allow “impromptu checks”, otherwise known as “Papers please!” is not a bug, it’s a feature that distinguishes our democracy from other states and we are pretty proud of it.

That unfortunately can, and will change.

In times of war, civil liberties get curtailed. And in 2025 when Russian and Chinese bots are interfering in our democracy at an industrial scale to destroy our countries from within, the idea of identity being overlooked for all aspects of public life is looking increasingly untenable.

Re: Britain to introduce compulsory digital ID for workers

#293

Post by masfuerte »

gattr wrote: post #260

> Stored on mobile phones, the ID would contain details including a name, date of birth, residency status and crucially a photo - which would distinguish it from National Insurance numbers. Surely it will be possible to also store it on some government-issued, GCHQ-vetted digital device, and not rely on foreign companies (Google/Apple) and their locked-down mobile platforms?

They've already said you won't need a mobile phone. They mention phones as a deliberate distraction from the fact that they will be building a huge central database.

I will be very surprised if the app does much more than dish up a pre-signed chunk of ID data, much like an e-passport does now. It won't actually need a secure device.

(Which isn't to say they will support anything except android and iphone.)

Re: Britain to introduce compulsory digital ID for workers

#294

Post by motbus3 »

notavalleyman wrote: post #278
reactordev wrote: post #270

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It has nothing to do with cards and everything to do with data.

But the person you're replying to, just explained to you, how the government already have the relevant data. So it's clearly not about data, because the government already issue his NINO and passport Edit - I mean, just play it back in your head. The PM is probably watching small boat arrivals and reform polling numbers like a hawk. And here's his idea to fix both problems, and you're saying, actually no, the PM is j…

I guess the guy above is right. It is about the data and the right to use your face and track you everywhere. This can be easily paired with that UK bonkers camera ai thing. They might not need to know who is illegal, but if the camera does not know you, you might need to explain yourself and show an id.

At the same time, I wonder how will they deal with people wearing burkas, masks, balaclavas etc

Re: Britain to introduce compulsory digital ID for workers

#295

Post by LinAGKar »

octo888 wrote: post #107
mrob wrote: post #89

It's incredibly misleading to call a phone app a "card". This is much worse than it sounds. Am I going to be forced to buy a smartphone? Am I going to be forced to run non-Free software? Am I going to be forced to enter into a restrictive contract with a foreign corporation?

Hah this is the UK. No, it'll be optional to begin with to make people like you asking important questions seem like a whacko. Then once they use propaganda to make people opt into it, and it reaches mass adoption, then it'll quietly be made mandatory - or extremely annoying not to have it

No, it will be mandatory right from the start, and employers will be required to check it

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/digital-id-ca...

Re: Britain to introduce compulsory digital ID for workers

#297

Post by octo888 »

voidUpdate wrote: post #284
billyjobob wrote: post #279

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The fact that the UK doesn’t allow “impromptu checks”, otherwise known as “Papers please!” is not a bug, it’s a feature that distinguishes our democracy from other states and we are pretty proud of it.

And in a situation where that is warranted (e.g. a traffic violation), you should probably have some form of proof of identification on you anyway

Not required by law in the UK to have ID on you while driving. Works well enough (you have to produce it at a station within 7 days). I'm sure if it's serious enough, the police can force some other method

Re: Britain to introduce compulsory digital ID for workers

#298

Post by matt-p »

netdevphoenix wrote: post #275
matt-p wrote: post #268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Good for them, but I don't see why we need this, or indeed why that's a good thing?

Easy and cheap regular checks on the spot presential or/and online, as frequently as you want vs rare scheduled difficult and expensive checks. Possibilities get realised such as regular remote checks (ie selfie to prove you are the id owner holder, address proof, etc, flagging odd id holder behaviour or employer, etc). Currently, you cannot do this, no visibility into who works where and where that person even resem…

I do selfie to prove I match my driver's license all the time (needed for app based banks, and so on)?

The government absolutely knows where I work, are you joking? That's what NI numbers are for. You seriously think there isn't a join table in a government database with my NI number and passport number?

Re: Britain to introduce compulsory digital ID for workers

#300

Post by stevekemp »

voidUpdate wrote: post #284
billyjobob wrote: post #279

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The fact that the UK doesn’t allow “impromptu checks”, otherwise known as “Papers please!” is not a bug, it’s a feature that distinguishes our democracy from other states and we are pretty proud of it.

And in a situation where that is warranted (e.g. a traffic violation), you should probably have some form of proof of identification on you anyway

In the UK you do not have to have your drivers license upon your person when driving a car. Usually you'll be instructed to present it to a nearby police station within a few days.
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