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Ode to libraries (the book ones)

sibervepunk.com

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Re: Ode to libraries (the book ones)

#21

Post by dpassens »

acdha wrote: post #11
dpassens wrote: post #10

> So what to do? Go to nearest coffee shop. You’re lucky if they don’t play tasteless trendy music. You’re lucky if a waiter doesn’t keep asking if you need anything, isn’t intrusive, and doesn’t subtly let you know when it’s time to leave by checking on you constantly . You’re lucky if no teenagers talking loudly about their-whatever-teens-talk-about-these-days. Oh, by the way, pay a lot of money to be here and to d…

That doesn’t sound to me as entitled, more like acknowledging that they’re not the market most coffee shop owners are targeting. I’ve known a few places with target laptop workers but commercial real estate pricing in many markets is brutal in a way that libraries are less exposed to.

That would have been a very fair point but to me, the tone definitely comes off as "how dare these annoying waiters try to sell me coffee so that the shop doesn't lose money from me occupying a seat" and "how dare teenagers enjoy their time in a coffee shop, don't they know I have work to do?"

Re: Ode to libraries (the book ones)

#22

Post by siberpunk »

dpassens wrote: post #21
acdha wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That doesn’t sound to me as entitled, more like acknowledging that they’re not the market most coffee shop owners are targeting. I’ve known a few places with target laptop workers but commercial real estate pricing in many markets is brutal in a way that libraries are less exposed to.

That would have been a very fair point but to me, the tone definitely comes off as "how dare these annoying waiters try to sell me coffee so that the shop doesn't lose money from me occupying a seat" and "how dare teenagers enjoy their time in a coffee shop, don't they know I have work to do?"

English isn’t my first language, so some sentences may have lost their nuance in translation. To me, that paragraph was more of a humorous, playful way of listing the aspects of working in a coffee shop that don’t suit me, rather than an angry, dissatisfied complaint.

Re: Ode to libraries (the book ones)

#23

Post by A4ET8a8uTh0_v2 »

dpassens wrote: post #10

> So what to do? Go to nearest coffee shop. You’re lucky if they don’t play tasteless trendy music. You’re lucky if a waiter doesn’t keep asking if you need anything, isn’t intrusive, and doesn’t subtly let you know when it’s time to leave by checking on you constantly . You’re lucky if no teenagers talking loudly about their-whatever-teens-talk-about-these-days. Oh, by the way, pay a lot of money to be here and to d…

Sure, but a coffee cup is not exactly expensive or difficult to make. The reason why companies tried so hard to make it inviting or 'third space' or whatever corporate types call it these days is that it helps sell severely overpriced sugar drinks of added caffeine.

This is not a shot at Starbucks. I love me some creme brulee, but it is important to recognize it for what it is.

Similarly, if it indeed is user entitlement that caused patrons to visit coffee shop and enjoy their drink in a nice space, then it was very much encouraged by corps for a good while ( for good reasons too -- apart from the historical ).

Re: Ode to libraries (the book ones)

#24

Post by ForHackernews »

One of my favorite libraries to work from was the Cudahy Library at the University of Loyola in Chicago. It's a stunning glass building looking out directly on Lake Michigan. I'm not sure if this is still the case, but it used to be that anyone who lived in the neighborhood could get a "community" library card without being a student.

https://chriswolak.com/2020/05/31/library-visit-loyola-unive...

Re: Ode to libraries (the book ones)

#25

Post by gardnr »

siberpunk wrote: post #12
dpassens wrote: post #10

> So what to do? Go to nearest coffee shop. You’re lucky if they don’t play tasteless trendy music. You’re lucky if a waiter doesn’t keep asking if you need anything, isn’t intrusive, and doesn’t subtly let you know when it’s time to leave by checking on you constantly . You’re lucky if no teenagers talking loudly about their-whatever-teens-talk-about-these-days. Oh, by the way, pay a lot of money to be here and to d…

Fair point, but we can’t ignore the fact that many coffee shops provide desks with power outlets, and sometimes even dedicated workspaces, and that this has become a clear trend. These coffee shops also earn revenue from customers who want a workspace, and they incorporate this into their marketing. So, cafes don’t rely solely on coffee sales; the environment they provide contributes significantly to their income. Ma…

There’s one cafe in Austin, Texas that turns off the wifi at 5pm. They have beer on tap. The live music starts around 7.

Great way to support the co-working vibe without killing the vibe-vibe.

Re: Ode to libraries (the book ones)

#27

Post by danielfalbo »

> So what to do? Go to nearest coffee shop. You’re lucky if they don’t play tasteless trendy music. You’re lucky if a waiter doesn’t keep asking if you need anything, isn’t intrusive, and doesn’t subtly let you know when it’s time to leave by checking on you constantly . You’re lucky if no teenagers talking loudly about their-whatever-teens-talk-about-these-days. Oh, by the way, pay a lot of money to be here and to drink a nice cup of burnt coffe.

You're right, but there are coffee shops that are actually friendly to work at. When I was living in Rome, I compiled for myself a maps list of work-friendly bars https://maps.app.goo.gl/8nZUdYEbs7H8MCDd7 - Now I moved to London and I'm doing the same

Re: Ode to libraries (the book ones)

#29

Post by siberpunk »

danielfalbo wrote: post #27

> So what to do? Go to nearest coffee shop. You’re lucky if they don’t play tasteless trendy music. You’re lucky if a waiter doesn’t keep asking if you need anything, isn’t intrusive, and doesn’t subtly let you know when it’s time to leave by checking on you constantly . You’re lucky if no teenagers talking loudly about their-whatever-teens-talk-about-these-days. Oh, by the way, pay a lot of money to be here and to d…

Absolutely, there are some coffee shops. Like you when I was in Istanbul, there were lots and lots of coffee shops, some of them even has two floors with top floor spared for working. Now I moved to a smaller city and I don't have these options anymore. That part was just my current experience. Also, thanks for sharing your list! I love spending time around the world in google maps, this will be my fun for today.

Re: Ode to libraries (the book ones)

#30

Post by ctkhn »

ctrlp wrote: post #20

In the US, libraries are free, have bathrooms, and you can spend the whole day. Hence, urban libraries have become de facto homeless shelters with all the social problems that implies. Suburban libraries are still pretty great places to work or read, but city libraries are a tragedy compared to what they were when I was growing up.

They definitely aren't as good as they could be, but I have always been able to get stuff done if I reserve a study room. Even suburban libraries are better like that
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