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Britain to introduce compulsory digital ID for workers

reuters.com

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Re: Britain to introduce compulsory digital ID for workers

#181

Post by celticninja »

jjgreen wrote: post #172

Before the election I was approached by a bubbly young woman who tried to persuade me to vote Labour: "No thanks, last time I did that they tried to introduce ID cards", "But that's not in our manifesto" she replied, "It wasn't the last time I voted for them either". It gives me no pleasure to be right on this.

Could you explain what it is you find so distasteful about ID cards?

I mean if you have a passport then you already have an 'ID card', but I certainly don't want to take that out with me to prove my age.

Re: Britain to introduce compulsory digital ID for workers

#182

Post by celticninja »

mytailorisrich wrote: post #179
celticninja wrote: post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

> What it will combat is illegal immigrants ability to work. No. That's a rubbish claim by the government. Employers must already check right to work and it is straightforward. Penalties are unlimited fines and jail, with penalties of 40k+ dished out on the first offence.

It is easily gamed and it requires providing documents, usually these are photos or reproductions of passports which are provided digitally and can be easily altered. And employers don't have the skill or ability to detect them, or often the will to investigate.. by having copies of the documents they can show they did what was required and claim to have been misled and they are the victims, so no prosecution or fines.

Re: Britain to introduce compulsory digital ID for workers

#183

Post by jjgreen »

celticninja wrote: post #181
jjgreen wrote: post #172

Before the election I was approached by a bubbly young woman who tried to persuade me to vote Labour: "No thanks, last time I did that they tried to introduce ID cards", "But that's not in our manifesto" she replied, "It wasn't the last time I voted for them either". It gives me no pleasure to be right on this.

Could you explain what it is you find so distasteful about ID cards? I mean if you have a passport then you already have an 'ID card', but I certainly don't want to take that out with me to prove my age.

Could you please give me your real name "celticninja", your phone number, your address, your NI number -- oh, and you'll need to install this app on your phone which I promise will never be used to monitor your location, purchases, friends. Then I'll explain.

Re: Britain to introduce compulsory digital ID for workers

#185

Post by mytailorisrich »

celticninja wrote: post #182
mytailorisrich wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What it will combat is illegal immigrants ability to work. No. That's a rubbish claim by the government. Employers must already check right to work and it is straightforward. Penalties are unlimited fines and jail, with penalties of 40k+ dished out on the first offence.

It is easily gamed and it requires providing documents, usually these are photos or reproductions of passports which are provided digitally and can be easily altered. And employers don't have the skill or ability to detect them, or often the will to investigate.. by having copies of the documents they can show they did what was required and claim to have been misled and they are the victims, so no prosecution or fine…

That's not how it works and it is not easily gamed.

You must provide your original passport, not a copy. And if you are a foreigner you must also provide a "share code" that allows the employer to go to the Home Office's website and check you details, including picture, and entitlement to live/work/study in the country.

Again, if some employers are unscrupulous, or just plain idiots, ID cards won't change that.

> by having copies of the documents they can show they did what was required and claim to have been misled and they are the victims, so no prosecution or fines.

On the contrary, this means 40k fine.

Re: Britain to introduce compulsory digital ID for workers

#188

Post by carlosjobim »

mrtksn wrote: post #83
carlosjobim wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just pick a country and start digging. It's not difficult. You can easily find web pages from different government departments, detailing exactly which rights illegal immigrants have, for example when it comes to health care or accommodation. The government web pages usually have links and references to the exact laws which mandate this. Illegal immigrants, as in people who have been denied asylum and ordered by the…

Okay, I pick Sweden. Go on

Just because Sweden is so easy, I'll give you a little. Then try doing something yourself instead of being lazy. Here's the public healthcare which local regions by law have to provide to asylum seekers and to illegal aliens:

https://www.socialstyrelsen.se/kunskapsstod-och-regler/omrad...

As you can see, it is quite extensive. Including abortion and health care for child birth. And of course transports to hospitals and health clinics, and an interpreter.

Here are some more regulations, detailing in which cases illegal aliens have the right to direct economic benefits from the public:

https://skr.se/skr/integrationsocialomsorg/asylochflyktingmo...

Notably, there is an "emergency situation" clause, which makes sure that even a person who has been expelled from the country and refuses to leave has a right to economic benefits.

Re: Britain to introduce compulsory digital ID for workers

#189

Post by aftergibson »

A secure, optional digital ID could be useful. But not in today’s UK. Why? Because the state has already shown it can’t be trusted with our data.

- Snoopers’ Charter (Investigatory Powers Act 2016): ISPs must keep a year’s worth of records of which websites you visit. More than 40 agencies—from MI5 to the Welsh Ambulance Service—can request it. MI5 has already broken the rules and kept data it shouldn’t have.

- Encryption backdoors: Ministers can issue “Technical Capability Notices” to force tech firms to weaken or bypass end-to-end encryption.

- Online Safety Act: Expands content-scanning powers that experts warn could undermine privacy for everyone.

- Palantir deals: The government has given £1.5 billion+ in contracts to a US surveillance firm that builds predictive-policing tools and runs the NHS’s new Federated Data Platform. Many of those deals are secret.

- Wall-to-wall cameras: Millions of CCTV cameras already make the UK one of the most surveilled countries in the world.

A universal digital ID would plug straight into this ecosystem, creating an always-on, uniquely identified record of where you go and what you do. Even if paper or card options exist on paper, smartphone-based systems will dominate in practice, leaving those without phones excluded or coerced.

I’m not against digital identity in principle. But until the UK government proves it can protect basic privacy—by rolling back mass data retention, ending encryption backdoor demands, and enforcing genuine oversight—any national digital ID is a surveillance power-grab waiting to happen.

I'm certain it's worked well in other countries, but I have zero trust in the UK government to handle this responsibility.

Re: Britain to introduce compulsory digital ID for workers

#190

Post by aftergibson »

xyzzy3000 wrote: post #149

The petition against this has so far managed to surpass the one opposing online age verification: https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/730194

I look forward to Parliament’s long-worded “no.” These petitions often seem more about managing dissent than enabling meaningful change.
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