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The health benefits of sunlight may outweigh the risk of skin cancer

economist.com

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Re: The health benefits of sunlight may outweigh the risk of skin cancer

#131

Post by jnsie »

lurking_swe wrote: post #128
namuol wrote: post #103

> A study published last year, for instance, examined medical data from 360,000 light-skinned Brits and found that greater exposure to UV radiation—either from living in Britain’s sunnier southern bits rather than the darker north, or from regularly using sunbeds—was correlated with either a 12% and 15% lower risk, respectively, of dying, even when the raised risk of skin cancer was taken into account. Emphasis on “m…

time of day and UV index is the most important thing, right? That is how you can accurately assess the “risk” of being exposed in direct sunlight. Example: would you put on sunscreen when playing volleyball at the beach at 4:30pm, if the UV index at that time is 2 (UVI scale)? That seems completely unnecessary imo. And many people are vitamin d deficient anyway, so the minor sun exposure would certainly do more good.…

How reliable are UV indexes? Genuine question. The iOS weather app is far from 100% reliable and I wonder the margin of error regarding the UV index number it provides.

Re: The health benefits of sunlight may outweigh the risk of skin cancer

#132

Post by elif »

namuol wrote: post #103

> A study published last year, for instance, examined medical data from 360,000 light-skinned Brits and found that greater exposure to UV radiation—either from living in Britain’s sunnier southern bits rather than the darker north, or from regularly using sunbeds—was correlated with either a 12% and 15% lower risk, respectively, of dying, even when the raised risk of skin cancer was taken into account. Emphasis on “m…

The only time you will see anything stated as an absolute is when there is low or no scientific rigor.

Thinking you are somehow holding the authors into account is akin to doubting a paper's veracity because it has "too many authors" or some other meaningless if not ironic standard.

Re: The health benefits of sunlight may outweigh the risk of skin cancer

#134

Post by Earw0rm »

namuol wrote: post #103

> A study published last year, for instance, examined medical data from 360,000 light-skinned Brits and found that greater exposure to UV radiation—either from living in Britain’s sunnier southern bits rather than the darker north, or from regularly using sunbeds—was correlated with either a 12% and 15% lower risk, respectively, of dying, even when the raised risk of skin cancer was taken into account. Emphasis on “m…

Bear in mind that this study is about the UK, and London is on the same latitude as Calgary, give or take.

The sun does get strong enough to burn here, but not for much of the year - especially considering the relatively high % cloud cover (not Seattle high maybe, but high). Skin cancer cases here are AFAIK most commonly related to overseas travel or people with outdoor lifestyles in the southwest of the country.

Re: The health benefits of sunlight may outweigh the risk of skin cancer

#135

Post by whatevertrevor »

pitpatagain wrote: post #76
brightball wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Since I was a little kid I was always skeptical of slathering something all over my body just to go outside. Just thought…how did people survive before this stuff if we really need it so bad.

People didn't used to expose themselves to as much direct sun and covered themselves with a lot more clothes. Traditional clothing in arid sunny areas typically covers everything, look at people in the middle east today. I live in a very sunny desert area and it's kind of funny when people assume people from here would be "more tanned". We stay in the shade, the sun will kill you! Anyone working outside is wearing wi…

Yup, I grew up in a hot subtropical climate and the best counter to the summer was to stay indoors, hydrate. If you have to be outdoors, stay in the shade, if you have to be exposed to the sun, cover yourself. All of the benefits you get from being in direct sunlight can be gained with just being outdoors in shaded areas, maybe for a slightly longer time.

The way western culture glorifies direct exposure to the sun is always hilarious to me, everyone lining up to burn their skin for hours on end to "catch up" on sunlight exposure. Instead of just playing an outdoor sport under some trees or being outdoors in the morning/evening when sunlight is a lot less potent and weather is a lot more pleasant.

Re: The health benefits of sunlight may outweigh the risk of skin cancer

#136

Post by Earw0rm »

brightball wrote: post #66
pinkmuffinere wrote: post #33

It’s tempting to see things like this and think “well of course it does, because that’s how we evolved”. But I think that might just be post-rationalization? At the very least, I think the argument _doesn’t_ hold for periodic famine, extreme temperatures, most disease, etc even though we also evolved with those things. Is there any guiding principle that separates the things-we-evolved-with-that-are-good vs the -that…

Since I was a little kid I was always skeptical of slathering something all over my body just to go outside. Just thought…how did people survive before this stuff if we really need it so bad.

White people - depending on your definition, I mean pale-skinned Northern Europeans - are adapted to live north of about 45 degrees.

Obviously they live lots of other places now, but evolution is slow to catch up.

If you drive through France for a day, you can literally see the change from north to south, "could be Dutch" in the far north to "could be Spanish" in the south. Of course lots of people move around but I'm talking about averages.

Re: The health benefits of sunlight may outweigh the risk of skin cancer

#137

Post by whatevertrevor »

wewxjfq wrote: post #46

The way I see it: If you live where your ancestors lived for thousands of years and if you make sure your skin gets gradually attuned to the sun each year, you probably get more health benefits. But beware if you're of Northern European ancestry living in Southern USA or Australia or if you work an office job and only seek the summer sun with pale skin.

I have no reliable and in-depth data on how many of my ancestors died of skin cancer, or how many hours they exposed themselves to sunlight, and what kind of sunlight, or what clothes they wore over those thousands of years.

Using this line of thinking is at best an attempt at rationalizing what lifestyle you wanted to live anyway.

Re: The health benefits of sunlight may outweigh the risk of skin cancer

#138

Post by anthomtb »

brightball wrote: post #66
pinkmuffinere wrote: post #33

It’s tempting to see things like this and think “well of course it does, because that’s how we evolved”. But I think that might just be post-rationalization? At the very least, I think the argument _doesn’t_ hold for periodic famine, extreme temperatures, most disease, etc even though we also evolved with those things. Is there any guiding principle that separates the things-we-evolved-with-that-are-good vs the -that…

Since I was a little kid I was always skeptical of slathering something all over my body just to go outside. Just thought…how did people survive before this stuff if we really need it so bad.

> skeptical of slathering something all over my body just to go outside

Missing nuance: Outside for how long? And how strong is the sun?

Even with my pasty Northern European complexion, I'm skipping the sunscreen for a 20 minute walk to lunch in November. But for a 10 hour hike above treeline in July? I'll be re-applying every two hours.

Re: The health benefits of sunlight may outweigh the risk of skin cancer

#139

Post by cameronh90 »

Earw0rm wrote: post #134
namuol wrote: post #103

> A study published last year, for instance, examined medical data from 360,000 light-skinned Brits and found that greater exposure to UV radiation—either from living in Britain’s sunnier southern bits rather than the darker north, or from regularly using sunbeds—was correlated with either a 12% and 15% lower risk, respectively, of dying, even when the raised risk of skin cancer was taken into account. Emphasis on “m…

Bear in mind that this study is about the UK, and London is on the same latitude as Calgary, give or take. The sun does get strong enough to burn here, but not for much of the year - especially considering the relatively high % cloud cover (not Seattle high maybe, but high). Skin cancer cases here are AFAIK most commonly related to overseas travel or people with outdoor lifestyles in the southwest of the country.

> but not for much of the year

Speak for yourself. Thanks to my Celtic genetics, I get sunburnt if I put my phone brightness too high. ;)

Re: The health benefits of sunlight may outweigh the risk of skin cancer

#140

Post by Earw0rm »

mcdeltat wrote: post #49
cpf_au wrote: post #7

Yeah not as a pasty white guy in Australia

Australia is exceptionally bad for the sun. It's crazy because the incidence of skin cancer is still so high even though sun protection is drilled into us since birth. I'll rant further that Australia is not even good from a UV/temperature tradeoff because the UV is always ridiculously high. Nice warm Mediterranean summer UV level is equivalent to a freezing cold winter day in Australia.

It's because you're the same latitude as Namibia, Botswana etc. Even Perth is on the same equivalent (south instead of north) as Cairo or Kuwait.

There's a reason the indigenous Australians stayed dark skinned after 40,000 years - a time frame more than long enough for the Irish to turn red-haired and pale; as a trait it's relatively fast evolving, Europe probably evolved most/all of its variation since the last ice age.

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