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U.S. investors, Trump close in on TikTok deal with China

wsj.com

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Re: U.S. investors, Trump close in on TikTok deal with China

#691

Post by watwut »

slg wrote: post #520
staticautomatic wrote: post #407

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seems obvious to me that this is so the government can force the platform to silence users who are critical of the government.

You're right, it seems obvious. Considering the number of self-professed "free speech absolutists" I have encountered on this site over the years, I'm surprised at how much benefit of the doubt others are giving this.

The thing is, self-professed "free speech absolutists" generally believe that only right with and nazi speech are the ones worthy of defense. Anybody else who is criticizing those, disagreeing with those or promoting other ideas is seen as threat to free speech.

Self-professed "free speech absolutists" get really angry when left or anti right people speak or make the right uncomfortable.

Re: U.S. investors, Trump close in on TikTok deal with China

#692

Post by zamadatix »

slg wrote: post #583
Pxtl wrote: post #566

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not. The last few years have made it very clear what the actual political goals of the VC-tech world are. I was as disappointed as anybody, but I'm not surprised anymore.

I was trying to be more neutral, but after some thought, this isn't the time for that. My "surprise" was more than a bit sarcastic. Between this and the FCC going after Kimmel, now is the last chance I will give for anyone claiming to care about free speech to prove they weren't lying. There's no plausible deniability anymore, free speech is unambiguously under attack.

I'm glad you finally agree free speech under attack. Now that the president/party in power has changed, it seems the comments have shifted from being that "I must be left wing" to "I must be right wing".

Is there anything that will make you interested in free speech itself, or is it just an attack towards those you disagree with? People don't want to waste time in an internet debate with someone who starts off with an assumption of the latter, and you've already concluded you were being sarcastic in asking. The lack of interest in responding to you about it will only help drive your belief "the other people" are the only ones who claim to care about free speech.

Re: U.S. investors, Trump close in on TikTok deal with China

#693

Post by vFunct »

otterley wrote: post #490
vFunct wrote: post #440

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's right there in what you wrote. It's why you got downvoted.

Are you calling me a genocidal Zionist? Yes or no, and on what, precisely, is your conclusion based? And what other posts and comments are you referring to in your complaint?

[flagged]

Re: U.S. investors, Trump close in on TikTok deal with China

#694

Post by dpkirchner »

Jensson wrote: post #596
nebula8804 wrote: post #541

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh great now Americans get to talk about things the US government could care less about while at the same time losing the ability to criticize Israel or the current administration. Does not sound like a great win. There were plenty of platforms to talk about those topics already. What didn't exist was a platform that expressly talked about things the US does not like. It could be argued that the rise in pro-palestine…

> losing the ability to criticize Israel or the current administration When did Americans lose that ability? I didn't hear about this happening. > could be argued that the rise in pro-palestine awareness post Oct 7 is in part to TikTok. Thats likely going away now so Americans on the whole are left worse off. The only thing that changed is that China can't choose what you get shown, do you think that the pro-palestin…

> When did Americans lose that ability? I didn't hear about this happening.

You haven't heard about the government pressuring universities to prevent students protesting Israel? Or about anti-BDS laws?

Re: U.S. investors, Trump close in on TikTok deal with China

#695

Post by epistasis »

jfengel wrote: post #685
epistasis wrote: post #519

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As soon as the appointee is appointed by a Democratic politician, at least.

That won't help. The count is currently 6 Republicans to 3 Democrats. The party isn't an absolute predictor of how they'll vote, but it's pretty close. It would take a minimum of two Republicans to retire, and be replaced by Democrats, to change the partisan balance. The oldest justice is Clarence Thomas, but the next two are both Democrats. Everybody else is under 70 and will not retire for a minimum of a decade.

I'm talking about the appointee to the board of the US-TikTok; I doubt the Supreme Court will have any objection until it is favorable for their partisan politics. (I hope I am wrong, but the past years have made me quite cynical)

Re: U.S. investors, Trump close in on TikTok deal with China

#696

Post by johnecheck »

amatecha wrote: post #272
barbazoo wrote: post #117

I'm not an expert but this makes me think that it might time to turn off the screens and stop letting half-trillionaires decide what we look at.

Use Fediverse/ActivityPub, XMPP (maybe matrix), IRC. Use protocols, not "apps"/"platforms". Stop using corporate-owned centralized services. Well, unless you like being the subject of exploitation and manipulation of course.

No mention of atproto. Obviously Bluesky is nothing to write home about, but do you see some reason why the atproto couldn't be the foundation for something more interesting?

Re: U.S. investors, Trump close in on TikTok deal with China

#697

Post by otterley »

volleyball wrote: post #629
otterley wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

In large part, yes. There is also Trump, Republicans and their drive to carve out a bigger conservative-space in a liberal-dominated media landscape. There is Silicon valley, the rising digital-military-industrial complex, the china hawks, the intelligence apparatus and the security state, and the usual self-interests of the billionaire class. All of these forces are currently colluding to control the narrative (i.e.…

Now would be a good time to remind people that freedom of speech, whether you like it or not, applies to large entities as well as individuals. TikTok is as free to boost a pro-Israel narrative as you are to boost an anti-Israel narrative.

Stating that there’s some sort of “mind control” at work is both false and insults people’s intelligence. For one, there is literally no way to “control” someone’s mind. Influence is not control. It’s not the same as shaping a narrative. I think you ought to choose your words more responsibly and accurately.

What’s needed is to protect the marketplace of ideas from which people can choose for themselves. Some people will carry larger megaphones and have bigger venues than others. But being louder and bigger doesn’t assure the outcome you want. History has illustrated time and time again that minority opinions can, in the fullness of time, become majority ones.

And if they don’t, it doesn’t necessarily mean the opinion wasn’t heard. (I doubt people haven’t heard that Israel is committing atrocities or that Gaza is a horrible mess.) Some ideas just fail for lack of popularity or traction. You might think you’re right, but the majority just might not agree with you.

And even if major media outlets are all pushing your favorite narrative, that’s no guarantee of an outcome, either. If every major media outlet came on TV and social media tomorrow and said hemlock juice is good for you, I wouldn’t buy it.

Re: U.S. investors, Trump close in on TikTok deal with China

#698

Post by johnecheck »

deadbabe wrote: post #470
amatecha wrote: post #272

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Use Fediverse/ActivityPub, XMPP (maybe matrix), IRC. Use protocols, not "apps"/"platforms". Stop using corporate-owned centralized services. Well, unless you like being the subject of exploitation and manipulation of course.

The nuance of protocols vs apps though is lost on the masses. Most people just want to stare at reels or be stared at in reels. This means that the only people you will encounter in protocols will be privacy freak type nerds and “normal” people you might actually feel better interacting with or watching are on popular apps.

This is Hacker News, none of us are normal :p

I think it's really that highly motivated individuals will power through garbage UX that regular users won't. Upsides like decentralization are abstract, UX is concrete. You need to get the UX right to give your real benefits a chance to shine.

Re: U.S. investors, Trump close in on TikTok deal with China

#699

Post by tw04 »

otterley wrote: post #34
tw04 wrote: post #32

I hope this is sounding alarm bells for everyone else as much as me. Larry's son buys Paramount (CBS) and promptly fires Stephen Colbert, a money making machine who was leading his timeslot as what was, in hindsight, a clear message to everyone that nobody is safe if they don't fall in line. Larry now gets TikTok, which like it or not is the most influential social media platform among today's youth. Both are Trump f…

> Stephen Colbert, a money making machine Unfortunately not: https://www.nytimes.com/2025/07/18/business/media/stephen-co...

Yes, as with all well-run businesses, it's common to terminate your flagship products due to one down year without any attempts to fix cost overruns. There's a reason the people at CBS keep leaking that it lost $50m last year but don't tell you how much it lost or made the previous 5 years, they just say "viewership was down since COVID".

https://daringfireball.net/linked/2025/07/20/wsj-late-night-...

Re: U.S. investors, Trump close in on TikTok deal with China

#700

Post by tsunamifury »

klipt wrote: post #563
tsunamifury wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is a significant difference in a population of 70 million educated workers who need to be maintained for high performance and 400 million low skill workers who are highly replaceable. I am trying to make no judgement here, just explaining then 'motivational environment' This math of course is in flux to a degree we haven't seen in maybe 1000+ years though right now.

> 70 million educated workers who need to be maintained for high performance But what if AI surpasses human skill and now you have need for 0 educated workers. Not good for human citizens...

Thus my final statement about this math being in flux
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