Live data from Hacker News

The power of ignoring mainstream news

joel.is

41–50 of 108 posts

Re: The power of ignoring mainstream news

#41
post #29

I found that when I let mainstream news go and tried to stay informed via social media, blogs, and Reddit, I felt informed. Then I got a Kindle and tried a mainstream newspaper subscription. I quickly noticed that the newspaper often disagreed with what I'd "learn" from Reddit and blogs, and upon further investigation the newspaper was almost always correct. Apparently the Reddit circle jerk is not as good at news as…

Eh, as much as I want to agree with you (and I do, reddit is a cesspool at times) you still can't argue with this: http://query.nytimes.com/search/sitesearch/#/trapwire/since1... and this: http://query.nytimes.com/search/sitesearch/#/flame Trapwire: funded by rich people who don't want to get noticed Flame: software showing off the usa's capability for cryptovirology and basically saying our most public stuff beats y…

You can't argue with that because that isn't an argument.

Most companies are funded by rich people.

Who knows whether Trapwire "wants to get noticed"? They sell to giant organizations, not to the public.

Most of what you know about Trapwire probably comes via Stratfor thirdhand via Wikileaks by way of Reddit. Think about that again: your information started at Stratfor. It was then spun by Wikileaks. And then it was analyzed by Reddit. And you trust it more than the NYT.

And all the while, Trapwire had a web page describing all this stuff.

One reason why the NYT and WaPo and WSJ and Al Jazeera are so much better than Reddit at conveying the news is that they have something to lose when they get the story wrong. All of them trade on reputations that took decades to build. You can literally feel this in action as you race to start typing about how the NYT got Iraq wrong. Notice how you can't say that about any story on Reddit, because it's a howling mob of random people?

(FWIW: There are great comments on Reddit; their highs are higher than HN's highs, by a lot.)

Re: The power of ignoring mainstream news

#42
There was a time when I should have felt terribly ashamed of not being up-to-date. I lived in a chronic apprehension lest I might, so to speak, miss the last bus, and so find myself stranded and benighted, in a desert of demodedness, while others, more nimble than myself, had already climbed on board, taken their tickets and set out toward those bright but, alas, ever receding goals of Modernity and Sophistication. Now, however, I have grown shameless, I have lost my fears. I can watch unmoved the departure of the last social-cultural bus—the innumerable last buses, which are starting at every instant in all the world’s capitals. I make no effort to board them, and when the noise of each departure has died down, “Thank goodness!” is what I say to myself in the solitude. I find nowadays that I simply don’t want to be up-to-date. I have lost all desire to see and do the things, the seeing and doing of which entitle a man to regard himself as superiorly knowing, sophisticated, unprovincial; I have lost all desire to frequent the places and people that a man simply must frequent, if he is not to be regarded as a poor creature hopelessly out of the swim. “Be up-to-date!” is the categorical imperative of those who scramble for the last bus. But it is an imperative whose cogency I refuse to admit. When it is a question of doing something which I regard as a duty I am as ready as anyone else to put up with discomfort. But being up-to-date and in the swim has ceased, so far as I am concerned, to be a duty. Why should I have my feelings outraged, why should I submit to being bored and disgusted for the sake of somebody else’s categorical imperative? Why? There is no reason. So I simply avoid most of the manifestations of that so-called “life” which my contemporaries seem to be so unaccountably anxious to “see”; I keep out of range of the “art” they think is so vitally necessary to “keep up with”; I flee from those “good times” in the “having” of which they are prepared to spend so lavishly of their energy and cash.

From "Silence is Golden" by Aldous Huxley

Re: The power of ignoring mainstream news

#43
post #29

I found that when I let mainstream news go and tried to stay informed via social media, blogs, and Reddit, I felt informed. Then I got a Kindle and tried a mainstream newspaper subscription. I quickly noticed that the newspaper often disagreed with what I'd "learn" from Reddit and blogs, and upon further investigation the newspaper was almost always correct. Apparently the Reddit circle jerk is not as good at news as…

There is bad mainstream news as well as online. But i would agree that near it's peak professional journalism (eg the economist, democracy now, new scientist) is generally better. But are these, or increasingly any serious newspapers 'mainstream'? US TV news is almost universally tripe.

Re: The power of ignoring mainstream news

#44
post #29

I found that when I let mainstream news go and tried to stay informed via social media, blogs, and Reddit, I felt informed. Then I got a Kindle and tried a mainstream newspaper subscription. I quickly noticed that the newspaper often disagreed with what I'd "learn" from Reddit and blogs, and upon further investigation the newspaper was almost always correct. Apparently the Reddit circle jerk is not as good at news as…

Examples?

1. Go to reddit.com/r/science

2. Pick an article

3. Go to comments to find out why the outlandish claim is wrong

Similarly politics, news; although a lot of that is selection.

Re: The power of ignoring mainstream news

#45
post #28

I do not mean to disagree with the OP, but here's a thought: What would happen if we required someone like Warren Buffet to ignore the news? What if he was prohibited from reading a single newspaper? What would happen? I know many people who read multiple newspapers every day, without fail. If they were not allowed access to the news, I think their ability to function in their chosen profession would be severely impa…

> What would happen if we required someone like Warren Buffet to ignore the news?

I think that's missing the point a bit. The OP was pointing out that there is an opportunity cost of consuming the news. For the OP, the return on his time investment was not worth it. But for someone like Warren Buffet, it obviously would be.

Re: The power of ignoring mainstream news

#46
This is terrible advice and not something I think people should be recommending to others. I love Joel's posts enough to subscribe to the rss feed (which I have never done for any site ever) but this post is something I strongly disagree with for many good reasons.

The idea he puts forth is incredibly naive and has not been taken to its natural conclusion. He talks about the negative side of keeping up with the news while ignoring the many positives.

He puts forth a simple solution to a complex problem. The solution he comes up with is naive and extreme. The problem seems to be that news being biased and overwhelmingly negative puts a damper on your mood. It can also harm productivity when becoming too engrossed in it and when the news stirs up strong emotions. His point is valid but his solution is extreme.

I think it's this kind of attitude that is making Americans stupid when it comes to civics. People in this country (the US) have no clue what's going on in the world or domestically because they either don't follow the news at all or because all they can process at any given moment is some asinine sound bite that barely comes close to touching on the substance of an issue.

Following news isn't harming anyone's mental well being. Not following the news is what causes harm. We pay a price for ignorance and the bill is about due. Following the news keeps you informed, it expands your world beyond the narrow little bubble most people live in, and it makes you an informed citizen which then gives you the tools to make smart decisions and, if you're an entrepreneur especially, gives you insight into where your next opportunity may come from.

While Joel's points about the detrimental effect the news can have and the problems with the media itself are pretty valid, tuning out is the wrong solution. The real solution is to be aware that what you see and hear is often biased. Being aware of the business side of the news will make you a better, more informed consumer of news thus making any news you consume more valuable and often actionable.

Now, if watching the news and reading mainstream news outlets creates anxiety for you then you probably have to brush up on your skills as a consumer of news. You don't need to watch 8hours of CNN or read the newspaper cover to cover to be informed. Consuming mainstream news reasonably shouldnt be detrimental in any way to you.

Furthermore, the fact that he singles out "mainstream" news makes me worry. It implies that news sources outside of the mainstream are somehow better or more true. This is not the case. Many of these news sources outside the mainstream like the brag about how they are the only ones with the balls to report the "truth". Whenever anyone appoints themselves the authority on truth it's time to be skeptical. Everyone has an agenda and while mainstream news may have some major problems with bias and conflicts of interest, it doesn't mean they are completely without any credibility news outside the mainstream can be just as bad if not worse than mainstream news. These organizations often push a very biased agenda or peddle ridiculous conspiracy theories while claiming to be sources of truth. Many times both the conspiracy theories and extreme bias go together in a news outlet beyond the mainstream in an effort to push some agenda. I used to be a believer in "truth" and conspiracy theories (often being unable to tell the difference). Now I understand that truth is not always so clear cut. There are degrees of truth.

The best thing to do is not to ignore mainstream news but embrace it. Embrace it with a healthy amount of skepticism and logic. It will expose you to new ideas and keep you up on what's going on in the world. So long as you consume it smartly you won't have a problem.

This whole post seems to be born out of a non-problem. I mean it's a problem but a problem born out of going to extremes. I happen to be keeping up with the news and in particular the US presidential election. It sometimes makes me angry but not to the point of disrupting my life in any way at all. It doesn't keep me from being productive. I listen to the radio as I drive to the train and sometimes read a paper on the train itself. Thoughts of the news don't distract me at work or socially. And when I see or hear nonsense I can tell its nonsense and go on with my day.

This post is a recipe for ignorance. If you plan to live a monastic life or a certain lifestyle that allows you to get away with being uninformed then this is good advice. But for the vast majority of us living modern lives trying to get by in this world, it's a shortcut to happiness that has a price.

Re: The power of ignoring mainstream news

#47
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I keep Redditing, but unsubscribe from most of the default subreddits, and subscribe to TrueReddit, TrueAtheism, and whatever else holds my interest.

I pruned my subscription lists too, and now it's as if it's frozen. Beside those 2 you mentioned what else is time worthy ?

Well, what are your interests?

Re: The power of ignoring mainstream news

#48
post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eh, as much as I want to agree with you (and I do, reddit is a cesspool at times) you still can't argue with this: http://query.nytimes.com/search/sitesearch/#/trapwire/since1... and this: http://query.nytimes.com/search/sitesearch/#/flame Trapwire: funded by rich people who don't want to get noticed Flame: software showing off the usa's capability for cryptovirology and basically saying our most public stuff beats y…

You can't argue with that because that isn't an argument. Most companies are funded by rich people. Who knows whether Trapwire "wants to get noticed"? They sell to giant organizations, not to the public. Most of what you know about Trapwire probably comes via Stratfor thirdhand via Wikileaks by way of Reddit. Think about that again: your information started at Stratfor . It was then spun by Wikileaks . And then it wa…

There is a certain superior feeling people get from getting their news from a non mainstream source. It's cool to rebel against authority, easy to call people who believe established news outlets ignorant "sheep", and it makes one feel as if they're part of an exclusive club for real "truth seekers". This feeling lets people believe some of the nonsense that comes out of these sources. There's something about a small, underground news source that makes people believe whatever comes out of it without vetting whereas the same story out of the NYT would make the same people question it.

Everyone wants to root for the underdog and everyone wants to belong. Non-mainstream sources of news give people an outlet for that which is why they get a pass from "truth seekers" who like to claim they have high standards for what they consume.

You have a very healthy attitude about news consumption. It's very reasonable and you made a great point. I'm not saying these alternative sources of news don't ever get it right. It's not about that. The important thing is not the source of the news so much as your ability to detect bullshit. Put another way, the important thing is being a smart consumer of news. Making the kinds of connections you make in your comment and asking those types of questions you ask are what is important.

If only we could all sharpen our critical thinking skills not only would we be better news consumers but all news organizations large and small, mainstream or not, would be forced to raise the bar on their reporting and journalism as a profession.

Re: The power of ignoring mainstream news

#49
post #40

Here is the kernel of good advice in this post: consuming news can be addicting, can create a negative worldview, and might not provide the informational content you think it may. However, the author then makes a series of suggestions for all the things you should be doing with your time, such as: (a) playing videogames; (b) mentoring other startup founders; (c) building your own startup; (d) writing on your blog; (e…

This makes me wonder: which is more valuable? writing blog posts or reading actual news?

Depends on the goal. The answer is neither and both.

Re: The power of ignoring mainstream news

#50

This is terrible advice and not something I think people should be recommending to others. I love Joel's posts enough to subscribe to the rss feed (which I have never done for any site ever) but this post is something I strongly disagree with for many good reasons. The idea he puts forth is incredibly naive and has not been taken to its natural conclusion. He talks about the negative side of keeping up with the news…

Why do you think that being informed about "what is going on in the world" will translate into smart decision, which will themselves translate into changing the world?

(also, should we want to change the world? it's it better on its own??)

More so, do you think that what is short in the news are the most important problems, the real priorities?

It seems highly doubtful at best. Knowing may be half the battle, but if you can't action that knowledge it's useless.

Post reply on HN