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Programmers Must Take Vitamin D

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Re: Programmers Must Take Vitamin D

#111

Post by neilc »

AmaralHerberth wrote: post #82
bascule wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I thought it was funny that this blog post didn't mention getting outside as a potential solution. That said, it's not like it's a dichotomy: I take a daily vitamin D supplement, try to eat as much catfish and salmon as I can, and try to get out in the sun as much as possible. That said, getting out in the sun is a fairly nuanced debate. Most dermatologists will tell you not to, because of the risk of skin cancer, an…

Just an observation: there are certain time intervals in a day that you CAN get some sun exposure without worring (too much) about UV rays & skin cancer. I do not know about the rest of the world, but in tropical regions the intervals are 6-9 am and 4-6 pm. 15 minutes per day is enough in tropical regions and a bit more in other regions. Nevertheless, you have more than a couple of hours to get outside and get some s…

there are certain time intervals in a day that you CAN get some sun exposure without worring (too much) about UV rays & skin cancer

Note that it is exposure to ultraviolet light (particularly UVB) that causes the production of Vitamin D.

Re: Programmers Must Take Vitamin D

#112

Post by steffenfrost »

Devilboy wrote: post #73

Every day at about lunch time I go lie on the roof in the sun for 10 minutes - doctor's orders. I also take D supplements but that alone was not enough to get my levels back to the normal range so I have to get some actual sun as often as I can too. It's a bit of a 'damned if you do, damned if you don't' situation here in Australia: Approximately two in three Australians will be diagnosed with skin cancer before the…

You need to lay out during solar noon in the summer. In your 20s you can produce about 1k IU per minute for full body exposure, however, that goes down with age.

The sun's zenith has to be 45 degrees or higher in the sky for you to produce Vitamin D. A small spectrum of UVB (285 to 315 nm) is responsible for the subcutaneous photochemical synthesis of cholecalciferol, an important hormone of the endocrine system that we know as Vitamin D. Thus you want to avoid morning sun and late afternoon sun, and forget about it during the winter. So if your shadow is great than you are tall, avoid the sun.

You can google the time for solar noon in your local area. For example, in San Francisco, solar noon in for September 15th is 1:05 pm at which time the sun's zenith will only be 55 degrees. My runs in shorts and no shirt is soon coming to end for this season. http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/astronomy.html?n=224

Regarding the 'damned if you do, damned if you don't' situation, don't worry about it. Melanoma is an office worker's disease, people who vocationally work outside have a higher risk of melanoma. Huh? Lower Vitamin D levels increases your risk of melanoma. Go figure, and sun screen block UVB, not UVA. So the rise in skin cancer might be due to increase in the use of sun screen, not sun exposure per se. More people get skin cancer, the more shrill the dermatologist become about using sun screen, and so the cat bites itself in the tail. More on that here:

Skin Cancer/Sunscreen - the Dilemma http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eeXtGHSt-5o&feature=share...

My youtube playlist on Vitamin D: http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL997D20130A1069B8

Re: Programmers Must Take Vitamin D

#113

Post by steffenfrost »

aswanson wrote: post #83
awolf wrote: post #24

There are many different types of vitamin D synthesized in our bodies which require sunlight to form. The many varieties of D are used in an enormous amount of different chemical processes in our bodies- many of which are quite complex and not fully understood. Vitamin D supplements consist of (mostly) one type of Vitamin D. People are typically deficient in that specific type so mild supplementation is a reasonable…

Nitpicking, but I don't think we as a species have been here for 100 million years. I doubt we've been even as hairless as we are now for more than a few hundred thousand, so we may not have gotten as much sunlight due to that. But your point still stands.

I always wondered why the dogs always like to lay out in the sun and furred animals get their Vitamin D. Wikipedia: "In some animals, the presence of fur or feathers blocks the UV rays from reaching the skin. In birds and fur-bearing mammals, vitamin D is generated from the oily secretions of the skin deposited onto the feathers or fur and is obtained orally during grooming.[97]" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vitamin_D

Re: Programmers Must Take Vitamin D

#114

Post by bane »

petercooper wrote: post #104
bane wrote: post #25

I actually have to avoid Vitamin D. I have a disorder (Hypercalcaemia) that causes me to build up calcium in my blood. Vitamin D can rapidly improve the body's ability to absorb calcium (hence Vitamin D enriched milk). Too much calcium in your blood can lead to various physical nervous disorders (I get facial ticks in the muscles around my eyes) but can also result in various psychologically similar problems like dep…

How did you find out you have this? I've persistently had quite a few of the symptoms but nothing comes up on tests. In experimenting, I gave up all dairy which has helped a lot so I've simply been assuming I'm lactose intolerant..

Quite a few years ago I was suffering from lots of lethargy. I thought it might just be some kind of sleep apnea. A few blood tests showed an alarmingly high concentration of calcium in my blood which appeared to explain several secondary symptoms. I also have a family history of thyroid issues which is linked to it.

Cutting out vitamin d rich sources and most calcium rich sources had me back to normal within a few weeks. I'm back on calcium rich sources now without, much problem, but still need to watch for high vitamin d sources or the issues return.

Re: Programmers Must Take Vitamin D

#115

Post by mamoswined »

Devilboy wrote: post #73

Every day at about lunch time I go lie on the roof in the sun for 10 minutes - doctor's orders. I also take D supplements but that alone was not enough to get my levels back to the normal range so I have to get some actual sun as often as I can too. It's a bit of a 'damned if you do, damned if you don't' situation here in Australia: Approximately two in three Australians will be diagnosed with skin cancer before the…

If the supplements were not enough, I would worry about why you are not absorbing them. Have you been screened for Celiac disease?

Re: Programmers Must Take Vitamin D

#116

Post by ky3 »

No one has mentioned reptile lamps yet? Medical UVB is expensive and probably can't be bought without a license of some sort. Reptile lamps you can buy from a local pet store or online.

But nothing beats the real sun (and greenery and fresh air), obviously. Given that the discovery of Vitamin D, heck the whole concept of vitamins even, is relatively recent, we really don't know what else we don't know.

Re: Programmers Must Take Vitamin D

#117

Post by MDS100 »

dasil003 wrote: post #79
MDS100 wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The above Factors are mostly regarding Vitamin D production or exposure onto your retinas. Nobody is claiming you need to replace it entirely. The right strategy depends on the context and esp. at which ends of the normal distribution curve you are (regarding sun exposure). It's very seductive to argue from an evolutionary advantage perspective. It can be used to generate Hypotheses that need testing. But one shouldn…

> It's very seductive to argue from an evolutionary advantage perspective. It can be used to generate Hypotheses that need testing. But one shouldn't give health advice based on it. After all we brush teeth, wear clothes and benefit massively from machines and modern medicine. It's about sane defaults. The effort to validate every reasonable hypothesis is extraordinary, and sometimes impossible. We can't afford to li…

Doesn't seam to be such a good heuristic, honestly. Why not look first at what seem to work for (a large sample of) other people?

Then you don't have to follow that complicated evolutionary logic style thinking. (I know it's very trendy right not) In the end Nature isn't smart and can't think.

Re: Programmers Must Take Vitamin D

#118

Post by gwern »

gwern wrote: post #103
streptomycin wrote: post #88

Well, that's a pretty content-free article. And there are lots of posts here, with anecdotes and opinions... but nobody is talking about hard data, science, and (most importantly) clinical trials. Is that because it hasn't been proven through a real clinical trial that "programmers must take Vitamin D"?

It is pretty content-free, although I found interesting the claim that caffeine interferes with vitamin D uptake. I'll have to look into that (though the article included no references... ಠ_ಠ).

OK, I've looked into it; I think it's a pretty bogus claim.

My full writeup is too long for Hacker News comments: https://plus.google.com/103530621949492999968/posts/AUg3udez...

Re: Programmers Must Take Vitamin D

#119

Post by gwern »

gwern wrote: post #103
streptomycin wrote: post #88

Well, that's a pretty content-free article. And there are lots of posts here, with anecdotes and opinions... but nobody is talking about hard data, science, and (most importantly) clinical trials. Is that because it hasn't been proven through a real clinical trial that "programmers must take Vitamin D"?

It is pretty content-free, although I found interesting the claim that caffeine interferes with vitamin D uptake. I'll have to look into that (though the article included no references... ಠ_ಠ).

Finished researching it; claim is pretty bogus. My writeup is too long for Hacker News, however: https://plus.google.com/103530621949492999968/posts/AUg3udez...

Also emailed the blog post author Chris Hunt.

Re: Programmers Must Take Vitamin D

#120

Post by cat67 »

I took 10,000 ui a day for over a year to build my vit d level up to 176. I have multiple sclerosis. My goal is 200, have done a tone of research on the topic, toxicity levels, etc... For 12 years in a row, have had a relapse every winter, past winter didn't have one. One could say this is a coincedence, I say no. In the summer I am always out in the sun alday, mostly every day, shorts, t-shirt, etc... For some reason, my body doesn't absorb the vit d good. I have fair skin, that tans very well. Anyways, I just wanted to share my knowledge to help others.
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