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Nootropics – The Facts About “Smart Drugs”

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Re: Nootropics – The Facts About “Smart Drugs”

#11

Post by _feda_ »

kilian wrote: post #3

As someone whose diet is already high in eggs, meat etc. (paleo) I wonder how much effect this has. I am asking this because both fish oil supplements and magnesium supplements don't seem to have any additional beneficial effect on me. Anyone have experience with that?

I've been taking cod liver oil, ginseng, and multivitamin (vitamin A through D, thiamin etc.) for the past month or so along with a pretty healthy and substantial vegetarian diet. I couldn't say if it's benefited me or not because the effect seems so slight that it could only be measured with some pretty detailed self-tracking.

I'll be trying Neurozan (http://www.vitabiotics.com/Neurozan/) in the next few weeks.

Re: Nootropics – The Facts About “Smart Drugs”

#12

Post by krisoft »

huhtenberg wrote: post #8
stephengillie wrote: post #4

Unlike in athletics, academics isn’t necessarily a zero sum game. While in a race there is necessarily a winner and a loser, nobody in academics is held back if another student is better able to retain their information. No, but the doped student's advantage could cause her to be selected over another (undoped) student in college entrance exams, program entrance exams, and other educational competitions. Does this me…

So what? Sports are essentially about competing , so the playing field being leveled is important. Academics is about the advancement of science. If doping helps a student to find a cure for cancer, I see no reason to object.

Unless it's side-effect free, it could pose an ethical dilemma. Would you take a pill wich makes you a prodigy but shortens your expected lifetime with 5 year? What would you think about the same decision if the former prodigy level becomes the new average in your field because of the widespread use?

Re: Nootropics – The Facts About “Smart Drugs”

#14

Post by Alex3917 »

plantain wrote: post #2

There may be places out there to find reliable information on the efficacy and safety of prescription medication taken off-label, but a guest post from a seller of them certainly is not one.

Actually the good news is that it should actually be easier to find research on these drugs than your standard drugs because they're not being tested by big pharma, which means there should be much less of a file drawer effect.

That said, you'd have to be kind of dumb to think that you can improve your brain function by taking the same cocktail of drugs every day. Taking low doses of different stuff on an intermittent basis, maybe, but hammering the same receptors day in and day out and expecting some sort of longterm benefit is extremely naive.

Re: Nootropics – The Facts About “Smart Drugs”

#15

Post by logn »

crntaylor wrote: post #7

Potentially relevant - Johann Hari's article in HuffPost about his experiment with Provigil (aka Modafinil). http://www.huffingtonpost.com/johann-hari/my-experiment-with...

Some poker players have been talking about this one too to boost their performance.

http://articles.latimes.com/2007/dec/20/science/sci-braindop...

http://groanblog.livejournal.com/865.html

I've read elsewhere that it can be addictive.

Also, the LA Time article discusses Inderal, a beta-blocker which could be considered a smart drug since it eases nerves by reducing adrenaline rushes (no more shaky hands or pounding heart). Might be helpful to the hacker community if you're stricken by nerves working on a tight deadline.

Re: Nootropics – The Facts About “Smart Drugs”

#16

Post by jonnathanson »

A word of caution about vasodilators: I've seen them touted more and more frequently by nootropics enthusiasts, as though they're completely harmless. This is not necessarily true.

Blood pressure is a very meticulously regulated process in the body, with countless chemicals, hormones, and other endogenous signals in the mix. It's entirely possible, if uncommon, to overdose when self-administering vasodilating drugs. A lot of vasodilators work by ionically tweaking the fluid retention of the kidneys, which, if thrown out of whack, can lead to all sorts of not-so-fun problems.

In general, be careful when messing with your blood vessels, or with any drugs that change the ionic balance of your bloodstream.

The other thing I'd say is TANSTAAFL. Generally speaking, when you're upregulating one process or chemical in the body, you're downregulating another process or chemical. If you're not sure what's being ramped up, and what's being ramped down -- or, even scarier, if science doesn't quite know yet -- then proceed with a tiny bit of caution.

I don't mean to dump cold water on the idea of nootropics. Some of them seem pretty harmless. Some of them may indeed have a net benefit. Others...perhaps, but the jury's still out. In the meantime, I guess I am hesitant to treat my body like a lab experiment. Especially when there are so many proven, healthy, effective ways to enhance cognition. Such as exercise and study.

Re: Nootropics – The Facts About “Smart Drugs”

#17

Post by _gd3l »

stephengillie wrote: post #4

Unlike in athletics, academics isn’t necessarily a zero sum game. While in a race there is necessarily a winner and a loser, nobody in academics is held back if another student is better able to retain their information. No, but the doped student's advantage could cause her to be selected over another (undoped) student in college entrance exams, program entrance exams, and other educational competitions. Does this me…

Who cares if thinkers use drugs? They have since the dawn of time, and it's helped all of us by letting already brilliant people get an extra boost. Whether it's psychedelics, marijuana, or nootropics, we know substances can not-insignificantly impact our creativity and inspiration.

Nevermind what a specific college or professional sports organization has to say about this; maybe someday they'll start thinking themselves, perhaps with the help of some substances, and realize that maybe the "college entrance exams, program entrance exams, and other educational competitions" are themselves a bit silly in the context of trying to truly find important ideas.

Re: Nootropics – The Facts About “Smart Drugs”

#18

Post by _gd3l »

ScottAS wrote: post #13

It's too bad that this reads like spam. Anyone care to share links to legitimate research?

There are a lot of shitty survey-type studies, but there is some good mechanistic research you can turn up just by searching the specific chemical names on Pubmed (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed)

Re: Nootropics – The Facts About “Smart Drugs”

#19

Post by Permit »

krisoft wrote: post #12
huhtenberg wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So what? Sports are essentially about competing , so the playing field being leveled is important. Academics is about the advancement of science. If doping helps a student to find a cure for cancer, I see no reason to object.

Unless it's side-effect free, it could pose an ethical dilemma. Would you take a pill wich makes you a prodigy but shortens your expected lifetime with 5 year? What would you think about the same decision if the former prodigy level becomes the new average in your field because of the widespread use?

>Would you take a pill wich makes you a prodigy but shortens your expected lifetime with 5 year?

Absolutely. Perhaps it's the naivety of youth speaking, but I'd gladly trade 5 of the worst years of my life to improve the rest of them.

> What would you think about the same decision if the former prodigy level becomes the new average in your field because of the widespread use?

I'd argue the world would be a much better place if this was the case. The real question you might want to ask is what if these drugs become expensive and only the upper class can afford them. It might lead to a sort of catch 22 by which no one was interested in hiring less intelligent or less capable people who couldn't afford such drugs.

Re: Nootropics – The Facts About “Smart Drugs”

#20

Post by stef25 »

crntaylor wrote: post #7

Potentially relevant - Johann Hari's article in HuffPost about his experiment with Provigil (aka Modafinil). http://www.huffingtonpost.com/johann-hari/my-experiment-with...

I've tried it a few times and it's really great, I could code in a focussed way like never before. Too bad it's a drug and hard to get.
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