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Google can keep its Chrome browser but will be barred from exclusive contracts

cnbc.com

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Re: Google can keep its Chrome browser but will be barred from exclusive contracts

#51

Post by GuinansEyebrows »

xyzzy9563 wrote: post #22
stefan_ wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand. The court has ruled this already a year ago: > Google is a monopolist, and it has acted as one to maintain its monopoly What should be the effect of antitrust enforcement to a monopolists share price? We are looking at something structural after all.

Why should shareholders have to suffer just because the Google engineers were good at their job?

bluntly, because incentives for investors to benefit from anticompetitive practices should be removed, in order to deter those anticompetitive practices. regulation works when you let it.

Re: Google can keep its Chrome browser but will be barred from exclusive contracts

#52

Post by stackskipton »

judge2020 wrote: post #43
stackskipton wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Feels like judge was looking for any excuse not to apply harsh penalty and since Google brought up AI as competitor, the judge accepted it as acceptable excuse for very minor penalty.

I mean, it’s a legitimate concern. Google is bleeding so hard right now from Gen Z and especially Gen Alpha deciding to use ChatGPT first and foremost when asking questions that Google would’ve answered previously. Whether or not that means they should keep Chrome as a product is up for debate.

Under good Monopoly law, you would remedy the situation that got them to this point, not worry about their future. Chrome + Deals got to them to this point so that's what you unwind. If it causes Google to get weakened and AI finishes them off, that's just creative destruction at work and oh well.

Re: Google can keep its Chrome browser but will be barred from exclusive contracts

#53

Post by crazygringo »

bediger4000 wrote: post #49
jonas21 wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you not see ChatGPT and Claude as viable alternatives to search? They've certainly replaced a fair chunk of my queries.

I do not. I prefer to read the primary sources, LLM summaries are, after all, probabilistic, and based on syntax. I'm often looking for semantics, and an LLM really really is not going to give me that.

Funny, I use LLM's for so much search now because they understand my query semantically, not just its syntax. Keyword matching fails completely for certain types of searching.

Re: Google can keep its Chrome browser but will be barred from exclusive contracts

#54

Post by deepsquirrelnet »

coro_1 wrote: post #29
fidotron wrote: post #19

This is an astonishing victory for Google, they must be very happy about it. They get basically everything they want (keeping it all in the tent), plus a negotiating position on search deals where they can refuse something because they can't do it now. Quite why the judge is so concerned about the rise of AI factoring in here is beyond me. It's fundamentally an anticompetitive decision.

> Quite why the judge is so concerned about the rise of AI factoring in here is beyond me. Maybe because this remains Googles biggest threat. I'm still more impressed by other models. Public ones at least.

Google’s biggest threat is their own deteriorating search results. Gen Z/alpha are interesting barometers, because many of them probably can’t remember a time when Google search didn’t suck.

I would use Google if there was anything to find. At this point, just figure out if you’re looking for a reddit post, a Wikipedia article or a github repo and go to the source — or let Claude do it for you.

Re: Google can keep its Chrome browser but will be barred from exclusive contracts

#55

Post by frankchn »

motoxpro wrote: post #44

Thank goodness. Them spinning that out would have been a nightmare. Bad day to be Apple. Edit: I just checked the stock, I had no idea people priced in a split with that much certainty.

Why would it be bad for Apple? They get to keep the billions/year flowing in exchange for Google Search being the default on iOS devices. Google just can't pay to be the only search engine on iOS (but they have never done that afaik).

AAPL up 3%+ after hours.

Re: Google can keep its Chrome browser but will be barred from exclusive contracts

#56

Post by supernova87a »

By the way, a pet peeve of mine right now is that reporters covering court cases (and we have so many of public interest lately) never seem to simply paste the link to the online PDF decision/ruling for us all to read, right in the story. (and another user here kindly did that for us below: https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.dcd.223... )

It seems such a simple step (they must have been using the ruling PDF to write the story) yet why is it always such a hassle for them to feel that they should link the original content? I would rather be able to see the probably dozens of pages ruling with the full details rather than hear it secondhand from a reporter at this point. It feels like they want to be the gatekeepers of information, and poor ones at that.

I think it should be adopted as standard journalistic practice in fact -- reporting on court rulings must come with the PDF.

Aside from that, it will be interesting to see on what grounds the judge decided that this particular data sharing remedy was the solution. Can anyone now simply claim they're a competitor and get access to Google's tons of data?

I am not too familiar with antitrust precedent, but to what extent does the judge rule on how specific the data sharing need to be (what types of data, for what time span, how anonymized, etc. etc.) or appoint a special master? Why is that up to the judge versus the FTC or whoever to propose?

Re: Google can keep its Chrome browser but will be barred from exclusive contracts

#57

Post by crazygringo »

stefan_ wrote: post #8

When the stock pops 10% on the announcement you got your antitrust enforcement wrong.

Or, the antitrust enforcement would have been economically punishing without actually achieveing the antitrust aims at all, and therefore a net negative.

So no. The stock price change is reflective only of economic value. Not of whether an antitrust decision was correct or appropriate.

Re: Google can keep its Chrome browser but will be barred from exclusive contracts

#58

Post by skybrian »

bergfest wrote: post #34

They should be barred from shipping experimental or non-standardized features in Chrome to prevent them from abusing their monopoly and forcing others hands by creating de-facto standards without a fair discourse. Experimental features should be allowed in special Chrome builds targeted at developers only, and not be allowed to come preinstalled on any consumer device.

Why? It seems like new API's should be tested with real users before becoming a web standard, and origin trials were a big improvement over what happened before with webkit specific CSS, etc.

Re: Google can keep its Chrome browser but will be barred from exclusive contracts

#59

Post by xnx »

stackskipton wrote: post #52
judge2020 wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, it’s a legitimate concern. Google is bleeding so hard right now from Gen Z and especially Gen Alpha deciding to use ChatGPT first and foremost when asking questions that Google would’ve answered previously. Whether or not that means they should keep Chrome as a product is up for debate.

Under good Monopoly law, you would remedy the situation that got them to this point, not worry about their future. Chrome + Deals got to them to this point so that's what you unwind. If it causes Google to get weakened and AI finishes them off, that's just creative destruction at work and oh well.

The ease with which a total newcomer was able to steal share from Google is real-world evidence that there wasn't really a monopoly and that Google competitors (Bing, etc.) just sucked and didn't want to spend the money to be better.

Re: Google can keep its Chrome browser but will be barred from exclusive contracts

#60

Post by supernova87a »

stefan_ wrote: post #8

When the stock pops 10% on the announcement you got your antitrust enforcement wrong.

Why? Maybe stock price is just a reflection that whatever the penalty, even large, now there is legal certainty rather than unlimited risk.
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