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Next.js is infuriating

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Re: Next.js is infuriating

#411

Post by agent327 »

tankenmate wrote: post #343
throwaway77385 wrote: post #292

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm so glad I'm not the only one thinking this. I built a medium-complexity, money-making, production-grade app in Next.js and started out on Vercel's hosting (and Google Firebase) and then moved to hosting myself and stripping out Firebase, replacing it with Pocketbase. Pocketbase was the ONLY good thing about this journey. Everything else sucked just so terribly. Infinite complexity everywhere, breaking changes CON…

it might be a bit over the top but there is Cogent Core[0]; it supports apps on desktop, mobile apps, and the web. it even supports 2d and 3d. and it's all in go, backend and frontend (using WASM). [0] https://github.com/cogentcore/core

I typed "0" into the scaling field to see how it handled it, and couldn't recover from there...

Re: Next.js is infuriating

#412

Post by eawgewag »

yeah, nextjs middleware is garbage

imo, if docs never give a clear example of what something is for, that's a pretty good sign that this was just tacked on without considering any particular use case. i've come to realize that nextjs probably intends for us to use RSCs for most middleware-like behaviors

Re: Next.js is infuriating

#413

Post by rglover »

Shameless self-promotion, but I think people who agree here would enjoy my full-stack framework [1]. Just launched a new update that's much faster and has a lot more features. It was built for SaaS first, but works just as well for a traditional website. The ethos is "no rug pulls; it just works." Not the usual time waste of JS frameworks.

[1] https://cheatcode.co/joystick

Re: Next.js is infuriating

#414

Post by recursive »

fragmede wrote: post #396
whstl wrote: post #358

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It was interesting handling frontend interviews recently. We do a 30-min tops exercise where you create a React project to show how to use useState and useEffect, etc. I help with whatever command they want to use and allow Google/ChatGPT. More than half of the candidates had no idea how to use React without Next.js, and some argued it was impossible, even after I told them the opposite.

What are you really testing for? That sounds like a bad interview.

Basic react experience presumably. As a first approximation, it seems like every possible interview sounds like a bad interview to someone. What has worked well for you?

Re: Next.js is infuriating

#415

Post by recursive »

fragmede wrote: post #410
tacker2000 wrote: post #385

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The perfect solution is to use React for the frontend (where its main purpose and strengths lie) and use something like PHP, Java, ruby or whatever for the backend. This insanity of server side react introduces all kinds of unnecessary quirks. Also, the VC-funded Vercel is of course purposely dumbing down Next.js, so that everyone pays them. Its a trap everyone should be aware of.

Sounds like a conspiracy theory. What's wrong with making the framework easier to use? Yes, the company that's paying for development on the framework is also paying those developers to make the golden path for deployment to use that company's PaaS offering, but unless we all band together and GoFundMe a framework that doesn't, how else do you want framework development to happen? Heroku/Cloudflare/AWS/GCp's entirely…

> What's wrong with making the framework easier to use?

Vendor lock in. Magic leaky abstractions are great until you need to debug something a few layers down when the magic stops working.

> how else do you want framework development to happen?

Loosely affiliated open source efforts maybe. If that doesn't work, I would prefer to have none at all.

Re: Next.js is infuriating

#417

Post by motorest »

hungryhobbit wrote: post #361
motorest wrote: post #351

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The train of thought is “what is everyone using? I’ll use that too” I'm not so sure about that. We're seeing Next.js being pushed as the successor of create-react-app even in react.dev[1], which as a premise is kind of stupid. There is something wrong definitely going on. [1] https://react.dev/learn/creating-a-react-app

You have to remember, Next is the only framework that can support some of the features in the latest version of React. To many people, it's just basic logic: "everyone must want the latest React features, and the only way to get those is with Next, so everyone must want Next".

> You have to remember, Next is the only framework that can support some of the features in the latest version of React.

That is extremely fishy, isn't it?

Re: Next.js is infuriating

#418

Post by pjmlp »

Etheryte wrote: post #398
pjmlp wrote: post #344

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which Java framework has log4j working out of the box for serious production deployment?

Spring Boot for example, which is arguably one of the most common ways to do Java anything these days. If you're trying to make a point, it would be considerably easier if you just said what you mean, because so far you're not making one. You could've easily looked up any of these questions.

Wrong again.

Spring Boot doesn't provide a serious production quality deployment without configuration.

Bare bones logging into standard out, yes.

That isn't production quality.

Production quality is telemetry logging, log rotation and zipping, forwarding logs to Kibana or Datadog dashboard.

Re: Next.js is infuriating

#419

Post by kadhirvelm »

Well the thing that’s infuriating for me is feeling like there isn’t a good, well supported alternative for writing an enterprise grade React app that will be continue to be around. I used to rely on create-react-app, but now that that’s deprecated, I often find myself asking what else can I actually rely on? I don’t want to spend eng cycles dealing with webpack and stuff, this seems to be what the React team is endorsing so I guess I’m stuck?

Another thing I don’t know how to think about is the target market for nextjs seems to overlap with Ruby on Rails, a lot of e-commerce, media, etc. And most of these B2B apps I write are certainly not that…

Re: Next.js is infuriating

#420

Post by fatata123 »

fourseventy wrote: post #357
throwaway77385 wrote: post #292

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm so glad I'm not the only one thinking this. I built a medium-complexity, money-making, production-grade app in Next.js and started out on Vercel's hosting (and Google Firebase) and then moved to hosting myself and stripping out Firebase, replacing it with Pocketbase. Pocketbase was the ONLY good thing about this journey. Everything else sucked just so terribly. Infinite complexity everywhere, breaking changes CON…

" Codebases from years ago are still rock-solid." This is the biggest thing for me. I recently pulled down an 8 year old hobby Java/Maven project I had and it compiled and ran perfectly on the first try. Imagine trying to get an 8 year old javascript project to work...

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