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The day Return became Enter (2023)

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Re: The day Return became Enter (2023)

#31

Post by YZF »

Someone wrote: post #2

FTA: Apple also added Enter to the numeric keypad, although an Enter that almost exclusively did the same thing as Return. If applications followed the UI guidelines, Enter behaved like Return if enter didn’t make sense in the context and vice versa. Yes, that was mostly (when do you have UI to enter a multi-line text to be processed as a separate unit?) but when it mattered, return started a new line, and enter sent…

My 2013 MBP says `enter` above `return` ... Presumably shift is the modifier (I never use it).

Re: The day Return became Enter (2023)

#32

Post by JdeBP »

IgorPartola wrote: post #18
mproud wrote: post #13

Keys are often replaceable; and we can put our own labels on them. Why not “Sure”?

Make it so. Proceed. Engage. Take that! En Garde! Go! Blam! Start your engines! Yes. Forward. Eh, good enough.

If you have an "Internet" keyboard, you already have a "Forward" key.

Re: The day Return became Enter (2023)

#33

Post by wpm »

userbinator wrote: post #14

To me, "return" implies a "go back" action (like "backspace"), which is the opposite of "enter", so naming the key the latter makes more sense. Plenty of TUIs used the arrow keys, Backspace, and Enter for navigation. Also, the text is nicely readable but none of the images are viewable.

You’re “returning” whatever text you typed to the program accepting input.

Re: The day Return became Enter (2023)

#34

Post by adastra22 »

3036e4 wrote: post #29

Older (pre-1980 or so?) Swedish texts call it vagnretur. Literally a wagon (or carriage; Swedish has only a single word for those things) return. Guess English picked up the word carriage from French at some point and that word ended up being used for carriage return rather that wagon return that would have made as much sense to me, but that might sound weird to native speakers.

Why would wagon return make sense? I don’t see the connection. A carriage is something that holds things for transport. A wagon is specifically the wheeled thing that is pulled along. Typewriters aren’t wheeled transports.

Re: The day Return became Enter (2023)

#35

Post by falcor84 »

wpm wrote: post #33
userbinator wrote: post #14

To me, "return" implies a "go back" action (like "backspace"), which is the opposite of "enter", so naming the key the latter makes more sense. Plenty of TUIs used the arrow keys, Backspace, and Enter for navigation. Also, the text is nicely readable but none of the images are viewable.

You’re “returning” whatever text you typed to the program accepting input.

That doesn't quite fit the regular usage of the word. When someone asks you a question, you don't "return", but rather "respond" or "reply" or perhaps "submit" your response.

Re: The day Return became Enter (2023)

#36

Post by Etheryte »

adastra22 wrote: post #34
3036e4 wrote: post #29

Older (pre-1980 or so?) Swedish texts call it vagnretur. Literally a wagon (or carriage; Swedish has only a single word for those things) return. Guess English picked up the word carriage from French at some point and that word ended up being used for carriage return rather that wagon return that would have made as much sense to me, but that might sound weird to native speakers.

Why would wagon return make sense? I don’t see the connection. A carriage is something that holds things for transport. A wagon is specifically the wheeled thing that is pulled along. Typewriters aren’t wheeled transports.

It makes sense because it's the same word in Swedish, the distinction doesn't exist.

Re: The day Return became Enter (2023)

#37

Post by aldto »

wpm wrote: post #24
jasperry wrote: post #5

I remember being mildly intrigued as a kid when I started seeing PCs with the Enter key where my C64 had Return. It's ironic that, though we haven't seen a Return key for a long time, the down-left arrow symbol still used on many keyboards represents the motion of a carriage return. I guess there's no other symbol that would convey the meaning of Enter as well.

Every Apple keyboard, even the iPhone I’m typing this comment on, has had a Return key. Only the Num Pad has an Enter key on Apple’s keyboards.

And Fn+Return can be used for Enter if the keyboard doesn't have a Num Pad, for the few Applications that use it.

Re: The day Return became Enter (2023)

#38

Post by userbinator »

falcor84 wrote: post #35
wpm wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You’re “returning” whatever text you typed to the program accepting input.

That doesn't quite fit the regular usage of the word. When someone asks you a question, you don't "return", but rather "respond" or "reply" or perhaps "submit" your response.

Some people will "revert", which doesn't help matters much either.

Re: The day Return became Enter (2023)

#39

Post by amszmidt »

adastra22 wrote: post #34
3036e4 wrote: post #29

Older (pre-1980 or so?) Swedish texts call it vagnretur. Literally a wagon (or carriage; Swedish has only a single word for those things) return. Guess English picked up the word carriage from French at some point and that word ended up being used for carriage return rather that wagon return that would have made as much sense to me, but that might sound weird to native speakers.

Why would wagon return make sense? I don’t see the connection. A carriage is something that holds things for transport. A wagon is specifically the wheeled thing that is pulled along. Typewriters aren’t wheeled transports.

A carriage is a wagon that transports people, not "things", a carriage are also usually wheeled, just like wagons.

In this case, one reason why "wagon return" might have made more sense is because there is a wagon that holds the platen of the typewriter.

Re: The day Return became Enter (2023)

#40

Post by flomo »

esafak wrote: post #21
gyomu wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As I understand it, "return" is a shorthand for "carriage return" - as on typewriters, going to a new line meant returning the carriage to its original (start of line) position.

Going to a new line is "line feed", hence the combo CR/LF.

Yeah, it kinda blew my mind when I figured out that DOS was actually correct in that way, and unix was 'cheating' by magically inserting CR into the terminal codes.
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