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We should have the ability to run any code we want on hardware we own

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Re: We should have the ability to run any code we want on hardware we own

#31

Post by divan »

> It should be possible to run Android on an iPhone and manufacturers should be required by law to provide enough technical support and documentation to make the development of new operating systems possible

As someone who enjoyed Linux phones like the Nokia N900/950 and would love to see those hacker-spirited devices again, statements like this sound more than naïve to me. I can acknowledge my own interests here (having control over how exactly the device I own runs), but I can also see the interests of phone manufacturers — protecting revenue streams, managing liability and regulatory risks, optimizing hardware–software integration, and so on. I don't see how my own interests here outweigh collective interests here.

I also don’t see Apple or Google as merely companies that assemble parts and selling us "hardware". The decades when hardware and software were two disconnected worlds are gone.

Reading technical documentation on things like secure enclaves, UWB chips, computational photography stack, HRTF tuning, unified memory, TrueDepth cameras, AWDL, etc., it feels very wrong to support claims like the OP makes. “Hardware I own” sounds like you bought a pan and demand the right to cook any food you want. But we’re not buying pans anymore — we’re buying airplanes that also happen to serve food.

Re: We should have the ability to run any code we want on hardware we own

#34

Post by busterarm »

abtinf wrote: post #8
idle_zealot wrote: post #4

This makes the point that the real battle we should be fighting is not for control of Android/iOS, but the ability to run other operating systems on phones. That would be great, but as the author acknowledges, building those alternatives is basically impossible. Even assuming that building a solid alternative is feasible, though, I don't think their point stands. Generally I'm not keen on legislatively forcing a deve…

[flagged]

Why torture someone when you can make every aspect of their lives depend on your moat and then decide to kick them out?

Do you know how many people use Google, Apple or Meta for every single sign on for every app/website they use?

Re: We should have the ability to run any code we want on hardware we own

#36

Post by bsder »

idle_zealot wrote: post #4

This makes the point that the real battle we should be fighting is not for control of Android/iOS, but the ability to run other operating systems on phones. That would be great, but as the author acknowledges, building those alternatives is basically impossible. Even assuming that building a solid alternative is feasible, though, I don't think their point stands. Generally I'm not keen on legislatively forcing a deve…

The primary problem is that we can't build a phone and run it on a cellular carrier network. This is where legislation is needed.

Apple and Google are still a problem, but they are a secondary problem.

Re: We should have the ability to run any code we want on hardware we own

#37

Post by Krutonium »

add-sub-mul-div wrote: post #9
DrillShopper wrote: post #2

No, says the man in Hollywood - those cycles belong to the MPAA No, says the car manufacturers, those cycles belong to us No, says the nerds in Redmond, your computer belongs to us

Weird last example, Windows is freer than Apple/Google. There's no path to locking down Windows like Android or iOS, half the world would break. Apple originated and normalized this, Google is following.

Windows 10/11 S is that path. Microsoft has walked it already; They just have to push the net wider over time.

Re: We should have the ability to run any code we want on hardware we own

#38

Post by saurik »

divan wrote: post #31

> It should be possible to run Android on an iPhone and manufacturers should be required by law to provide enough technical support and documentation to make the development of new operating systems possible As someone who enjoyed Linux phones like the Nokia N900/950 and would love to see those hacker-spirited devices again, statements like this sound more than naïve to me. I can acknowledge my own interests here (ha…

It being difficult is different from it being possible. If a company wants to raise $50m to read all the documentation and build an alternative OS to run on this crazy piece of hardware, as the consumer I still benefit. If you'd prefer, let's stick with repair? I also need all of that information to be able to repair my phone, but again, it wouldn't necessarily be ME who repairs my own phone: I take it to a third-party expert who has built out their own expertise and tools.

(Hell: I'd personally be OK without "documentation"... it should simply be illegal to actively go out of your way to prevent people from doing this. This way you also aren't mandating anyone go to extra effort they otherwise wouldn't bother with: the status quo is that, because they can, they thrown down an incredible amount of effort trying to prevent people from figuring things out themselves, and that really sucks.)

Re: We should have the ability to run any code we want on hardware we own

#39

Post by micromacrofoot »

tbh I don't even care about support, just give me the keys

but ultimately it doesn't matter, if the market could bear the additional cost a competitor could emerge... but they barely do anywhere

honestly at this point in life I think it would be easier to change society to be structured in a way to make the people running these companies want to give it to you

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