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CDC officials’ resignation emails

insidemedicine.substack.com

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Re: CDC officials’ resignation emails

#81

Post by jeffbee »

throwawaymaths wrote: post #52
unsnap_biceps wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The mental health of the perpetrator is also a public health concern and could fairly be considered a epidemic

This is a problem. Government departments must have delimited authority and scope. There are other government and nonprofit entities tracking gun violence. Absolutely no need for CDC to get involved except for stupid politics. It's a distraction from their core mission.

The CDC was directed by Congress to prevent injuries by the 1986 Injury Prevention Act and the 1990 Injury Control Act, notwithstanding your superficial and frankly moronic understanding of the agency.

Re: CDC officials’ resignation emails

#82

Post by braiamp »

unsnap_biceps wrote: post #42
ceejayoz wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Help me understand how gunshot wounds have nothing to do with public health? They study the other common forms of death/injury. If anything, giving guns a special exemption from scrutiny is the political move.

The mental health of the perpetrator is also a public health concern and could fairly be considered a epidemic

And neither of those are being tackled at all. It's as it's all or nothing. I prefer always to tackle complex problems through multiple angles, because they are complex.

Re: CDC officials’ resignation emails

#83

Post by kristopolous »

throwawaymaths wrote: post #57
random3 wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So better throw the baby with the bath water and not have CDC then have CDC treat gun violence or suicides as an epidemic, yes?

[flagged]

No. The act of politics is dictating things based on a political ideology, for their advocacy or absence.

That's what you're doing, it's strict political advocacy.

I'm tired of people claiming something is political and then wanting to legislate it based on politics and claiming that isn't

Re: CDC officials’ resignation emails

#84

Post by jeffbee »

ceejayoz wrote: post #70
throwawaymaths wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

It would be deeply political for the CDC to ignore the top cause of death of children in the USA. If you oppose politicization of health, that should be an easy point of agreement.

It would also be political, and unlawful, for the CDC to fail to fulfill the mandate that Congress has given it to prevent injury for the last 39 years.

Re: CDC officials’ resignation emails

#85

Post by braiamp »

lubujackson wrote: post #53
ceejayoz wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Help me understand how gunshot wounds have nothing to do with public health? They study the other common forms of death/injury. If anything, giving guns a special exemption from scrutiny is the political move.

Don't have a dog in this race, but were they also tracking deatha from auto accidents and the like? Because if it was part of a big pie chart of how people die, then no problem. If it was specifically only about guns, then it was political.

All external injuries (mostly traumas, but also burns, poison, frostbite, etc.) that result in deaths, no matter their intention (murder, accident, suicide) have 2 chapters dedicated in the International Classification of Diseases 10 (also 11). Yes, tracking what harms and kills people is kinda important from the public health standpoint, so that there are resources to deal with the injuries and educate in case of prevention. It also happens to be interested in work related injuries too!

https://icd.who.int/browse10/2019/en#/XIX

https://icd.who.int/browse10/2019/en#/XX

Re: CDC officials’ resignation emails

#86

Post by krapp »

ajross wrote: post #37
protocolture wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Modern social media teaches you to either engage if the topic gives you happy brain feels, or disengage completely so it never shows up in your feed. The more you "fight" a cause, the more you promote it and the more you see it.

FWIW HN doesn't have personalized feeds like that. We all see the same front page. But regardless: The loons loved it indeed, and it was all over the front page. Right here. Blaming that on the rest of us seems ridiculous, but sort of besides the point. I don't care about blame, I'm saying that whoever you want to blame, it is us, right here, on HN , not some abstract "voters". We made this problem. We told people th…

I think you're overestimating how influential Hacker News is on the discourse of society at large.

Many people here were (and still are) solidly anti-vaccine but in the grand scheme Hacker News was just one of innumerable maelstroms on the internet, and far from the biggest. More realistically, Hacker news is just full of people who aren't any more immune to propaganda than anyone else.

Re: CDC officials’ resignation emails

#87

Post by senectus1 »

jiggawatts wrote: post #76
yongjik wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The inability for intelligent people to frame their policies and positions in ways very stupid simple people can understand "disease very bad. disease may kill. inject this. you less likely to get disease." => "How dare you infringe upon my bodily freedom!" Realistically, how farther down can we dumb things from here?

> "disease very bad. disease may kill. inject this. you less likely to get disease." The actual argument is that by everyone getting injected, society as a whole crosses a threshold where viruses fail to spread exponentially and don't cause pandemics. It's a more nuanced, more complex reason that some (incredibly selfish) people are just unable to grasp. "Why would I ever a tiny personal risk to stop other people get…

>"Why would I ever a tiny personal risk to stop other people getting sick!?" was a very common argument during the COVID pandemic.

its a very american take, but unfortunately that particular mind virus has spread very far and wide

Re: CDC officials’ resignation emails

#88

Post by CMay »

Is this about the upcoming reveal of the autism findings, or is the article just feeding that as the cause?

I thought the understanding for base rates of autism was that people are living longer and starting their lives later. Becoming financially stable later, having children later. Having children later rather than earlier significantly increased the risk of autism.

After that then the question becomes about intensity of autistic symptoms, where the base rate of autistic children makes sense given the data, but the intensity and thus increased likelihood of seeking diagnosis may be increasing as a second factor which sits on top of expanded diagnosis standards.

For intensity, there are suggestions that maybe obesity, plastics/chemicals could be contributing, but it sounded like there wasn't enough data on it.

I'm not sure what other answer they found. RFK has said he doesn't think people should follow his personal health advice. He knows he's neither a scientist or a doctor and supposedly there was some team of scientists working on it. I'm not prejudging that they can't have arrived at some useful result, but it's obviously very politicized.

Re: CDC officials’ resignation emails

#89

Post by ajross »

krapp wrote: post #86
ajross wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FWIW HN doesn't have personalized feeds like that. We all see the same front page. But regardless: The loons loved it indeed, and it was all over the front page. Right here. Blaming that on the rest of us seems ridiculous, but sort of besides the point. I don't care about blame, I'm saying that whoever you want to blame, it is us, right here, on HN , not some abstract "voters". We made this problem. We told people th…

I think you're overestimating how influential Hacker News is on the discourse of society at large. Many people here were (and still are) solidly anti-vaccine but in the grand scheme Hacker News was just one of innumerable maelstroms on the internet, and far from the biggest. More realistically, Hacker news is just full of people who aren't any more immune to propaganda than anyone else.

I'm not blaming HN specifically or especially, I'm saying that tut tutting about all those dumb "voters" and "Lysenkoists" is shortsighted. The problem is right here. If you want to know why "they" were so dumb you only need to answer why WE were equally dumb.

My general sense is that the tut-tut set is very much an overlap in the Venn diagram with the libertarians who deliberately enabled this nonsense originally and refuse to treat with their own complicity.

But I've spent most of my limited budget on posting about this, so I'll stop now.

Re: CDC officials’ resignation emails

#90

Post by o11c »

voidfunc wrote: post #27
vkou wrote: post #6

It's a crying shame that given the choice, the voters picked the modern-day equivalent of Lysenkoism[1]. [1] Which due to the timing of its adoption and abandonment did avoid outright causing famines in the Soviet Union... And went on to kill tens of millions of people in China.

The inability for intelligent people to frame their policies and positions in ways very stupid simple people can understand is the biggest failing of the last 50+ years if not longer.

At this point, I don't think it's an inability - all sorts of messages get broadcast - but an unwillingness to actually talk to people with different worldviews.

The easy way to spread a pro-health message to the people who really need to comply with it is to say "letting disease spread is Nergal worship (2 Kings 17:30), and America is a Christian nation." Just spam that, nonstop, until it is as embedded in their minds as whatever derangement Trump has come up with this time - because this is the kind of thing they respond to.

The second thing is more complicated: to admit that a lot of "sexual health" only applies to people engaging in highly risky behavior, and should be handled separately both in messaging and in practice from general health. You can still make them support it, but with an explicit "do good even to the sinner" messaging. Throw in a few "We are currently promoting abortion because free school lunches have been canceled" and you WILL see movement.

Both of these are considered abominable among the current Democrat party, because it involves speaking the language of people with different values.

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