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It is worth it to buy the fast CPU

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Re: It is worth it to buy the fast CPU

#141

Post by incone123 »

Aurornis wrote: post #117
avidiax wrote: post #10

Employers, even the rich FANG types, are quite penny-wise and pound-foolish when it comes to developer hardware. Limiting the number and size of monitors. Putting speedbumps (like assessments or doctor's notes) on ergo accessories. Requiring special approval for powerful hardware. Requiring special approval for travel, and setting hotel and airfare caps that haven't been adjusted for inflation. To be fair, I know ple…

Every well funded startup I’ve worked for went through a period where employees could get nearly anything they asked for: New computers, more monitors, special chairs, standing desks, SaaS software, DoorDash when working late. If engineers said they needed it, they got it. Then some period of time later they start looking at spending in detail and can’t believe how much is being spent by the 25% or so who abuse the p…

$3,000 standing desks?? It's some wood, metal and motors. I got one from IKEA in about 2018 for 500 gbp and it's still my desk today. You can get Chinese ones now for about 150 gbp.

Re: It is worth it to buy the fast CPU

#142

Post by diggan »

userbinator wrote: post #46

I wish developers, and I'm saying this as one myself, were forced to work on a much slower machine, to flush out those who can't write efficient code. Software bloat has already gotten worse by at least an order of magnitude in the past decade.

> were forced to work on a much slower machine

I feel like that's the wrong approach. Like saying a music producer to always work with horrible (think car or phone) speakers. True, you'll get a better mix and master if you test it on speakers you expect others to hear it through, but no one sane recommends you to default to use those for day-to-day work.

Same goes for programming, I'd lose my mind if everything was dog-slow, and I was forced to experience this just because someone thinks I'll make things faster for them if I'm forced to have a slower computer. Instead I'd just stop using my computer if the frustration ended up larger than the benefits and joy I get.

Re: It is worth it to buy the fast CPU

#143

Post by walterbell »

fmajid wrote: post #73
tgma wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FANG is not monolithic. Amazon is famously cheap. So is Apple in my opinion based on what I have heard (you get random refurbished hardware that is available not some standardized thing, sometimes with 8GB RAM sometimes something nicer) Apple is also famously cheap on their compensation. Back in the day they proudly said shit to the effect of "we deliberately don't pay you top of the market because you have to love A…

iOS development is still mostly local which is why most of the iOS developers at my previous Big Tech employer got Mac Studios as compiler machines in addition to their MacBook Pros. This requires director approval but is a formality. I read Google is now issuing Chromebooks instead of proper computers to non-engineers, which has got to be corrosive to productivity and morale.

> Chromebooks ... to non-engineers

"AI" (Plus) Chromebooks?

Re: It is worth it to buy the fast CPU

#144

Post by thenewwazoo »

loeg wrote: post #115
corimaith wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The cost of a good office chair is comparable to a top tier gaming pc, if not higher.

Are there any FANG employers unwilling to provide good office chairs? I think even cheap employers offer these.

There are many that won’t even assign desks, much less provide decent chairs. Amazon and LinkedIn are two examples I know from personal experience.

Re: It is worth it to buy the fast CPU

#145

Post by Aurornis »

incone123 wrote: post #141
Aurornis wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every well funded startup I’ve worked for went through a period where employees could get nearly anything they asked for: New computers, more monitors, special chairs, standing desks, SaaS software, DoorDash when working late. If engineers said they needed it, they got it. Then some period of time later they start looking at spending in detail and can’t believe how much is being spent by the 25% or so who abuse the p…

$3,000 standing desks?? It's some wood, metal and motors. I got one from IKEA in about 2018 for 500 gbp and it's still my desk today. You can get Chinese ones now for about 150 gbp.

The people demanding new top spec MacBook Pros every year aren’t the same people requesting the cheapest Chinese standing desk they can find.

Re: It is worth it to buy the fast CPU

#146

Post by hamdingers »

Aurornis wrote: post #130
hamdingers wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I previously worked at a company where everyone got a budget of ~$2000. The only requirement was you had to get a mac (to make it easier on IT I assume), the rest was up to you. Some people bought a $2000 macbook pro, some bought a $600 mac mini and used the rest on displays and other peripherals. Equality doesn't have to mean uniformity.

I saw this tried ones and it didn’t work. Some people would minimize the amount spent on their core hardware so they had money to spend on fun things. So you’d have to deal with someone whose 8GB RAM cheap computer couldn’t run the complicated integration tests but they were typing away on a $400 custom keyboard you didn’t even know existed while listening to their AirPods Max.

That's probably another reason why we were limited to a set menu of computer options.

Re: It is worth it to buy the fast CPU

#147

Post by forgotusername6 »

avidiax wrote: post #10

Employers, even the rich FANG types, are quite penny-wise and pound-foolish when it comes to developer hardware. Limiting the number and size of monitors. Putting speedbumps (like assessments or doctor's notes) on ergo accessories. Requiring special approval for powerful hardware. Requiring special approval for travel, and setting hotel and airfare caps that haven't been adjusted for inflation. To be fair, I know ple…

Just to do web development? I regularly go into swap running everything I need on my laptop. Ideally I'd have VScode, webpack, and jest running continuously. I'd also occasionally need playwright. That's all before I open a chrome tab.

Re: It is worth it to buy the fast CPU

#148

Post by Aurornis »

humanrebar wrote: post #140
Aurornis wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the latter…is fine. They stayed till they were supposed to. This is the soft fraud mentality: If a company offers meal delivery for people who are working late who need to eat at the office and then people start staying late (without working) and then taking the food home to eat, that’s not consistent with the policies. It was supposed to be a consolation if someone had to (or wanted to, as occurred with a lot of o…

Are you saying the mentality is offensive? Or is there a business justification I am missing? Note that employers do this as well. A classic one is a manager setting a deadline that requires extreme crunches by employees. They're not necessarily compensating anyone more for that. Are the managers within their rights? Technically. The employees could quit. But they're shaving hours, days, and years off of employees wi…

It’s basic expense fraud.

If a company policy says you can expense meals when taking clients out, but sales people started expensing their lunches when eating alone, it’s clearly expense fraud. I think this is obvious to everyone.

Yet when engineers are allowed to expense meals when they’re working late and eating at the office, but people who are neither working late nor eating at the office start expensing their meals, that’s expense fraud.

These things are really not gray area. It seems more obvious when we talk about sales people abusing budgets, but there’s a blind spot when we start talking about engineers doing it.

Re: It is worth it to buy the fast CPU

#149

Post by master_crab »

Aurornis wrote: post #136
master_crab wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

soft fraud mentality This isn’t about fraud anymore. It’s about how suspiciously managers want to view their employees. That’s a separate issue (but not one directed at employees).

If a company says you have permission to spend money on something for a purpose, but employees are abusing that to spend money on something that clearly violates that stated purpose, that’s into fraud territory. This is why I call it the soft fraud mentality: When people see some fraudulent spending and decide that it’s fine because they don’t think the policy is important. Managers didn’t care. It didn’t come out of…

This might come as a bit of a surprise to you, but most (really all) employees are in it for money. So if you are astonished that people optimize for their financial gain, that’s concerning. That’s why you implement rules.

If you start trying to tease apart the motivations people have even if they are following those rules, you are going to end up more paranoid than Stalin.

Re: It is worth it to buy the fast CPU

#150

Post by Aurornis »

master_crab wrote: post #149
Aurornis wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If a company says you have permission to spend money on something for a purpose, but employees are abusing that to spend money on something that clearly violates that stated purpose, that’s into fraud territory. This is why I call it the soft fraud mentality: When people see some fraudulent spending and decide that it’s fine because they don’t think the policy is important. Managers didn’t care. It didn’t come out of…

This might come as a bit of a surprise to you, but most (really all) employees are in it for money. So if you are astonished that people optimize for their financial gain, that’s concerning. That’s why you implement rules. If you start trying to tease apart the motivations people have even if they are following those rules, you are going to end up more paranoid than Stalin.

> This might come as a bit of a surprise to you

> So if you are astonished that people optimize for their financial gain, that’s concerning.

I’m not “surprised” nor “astonished” nor do you need to be “concerned” for me. That’s unnecessarily condescending.

I’m simply explaining how these generous policies come to and end through abuse.

You are making a point in favor of these policies: Many will see an opportunity for abuse and take it, so employers become more strict.

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