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Home Depot sued for 'secretly' using facial recognition at self-checkouts

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Re: Home Depot sued for 'secretly' using facial recognition at self-checkouts

#171

Post by drstewart »

danpalmer wrote: post #66
ProllyInfamous wrote: post #40

Home Depot's self-checkouts are using this facial ID to build/maintain their shoplifting database — this tracks thefts by the same person across multiple visits, and is used over time to build up a case against errant self-checkout-ers (i.e. to get them above a theft threshhold, at which point prosecution becomes easier). There is also CCTV AI (whether artificial intelligence, or actually indians) which can intervene…

> i.e. to get them above a theft threshhold, at which point prosecution becomes easier This feels like it should be illegal. Holding back on reporting or prosecuting until you think you're more likely to get a conviction or a bigger conviction, feels close to entrapment. To do otherwise is just unnecessarily vindictive, showing that it's the punishment that matters more than the prevention.

> feels close to entrapment

It doesn't feel close to entrapment at all.

Maybe you could argue they aren't doing their best to minimise losses and such aren't eligible for a full recovery of their losses, but not that the perpetrator didn't commit the offense.

Re: Home Depot sued for 'secretly' using facial recognition at self-checkouts

#172

Post by drstewart »

47282847 wrote: post #92

I make it a point not to use self-checkout systems because I want to support human interaction even if basic, and contribute to jobs for humans. And cash (most self-checkouts here are card-only). I understand it’s a losing battle on all fronts.

This is why I don't understand people who support mandatory online / one-click subscription cancellation. Support jobs and require people to call-in to a human to cancel. That's a human-centred system that contributes to jobs.

Re: Home Depot sued for 'secretly' using facial recognition at self-checkouts

#173

Post by andy99 »

ruszki wrote: post #140
bmn__ wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

AFAIK improving on poverty is a more effective approach.

Is there evidence of that? That seems to have been the prevailing view over the last many years, and it's not clear to me that it's improved anything. There seems to be more homeless camps, more petty crime, more drugs.

Re: Home Depot sued for 'secretly' using facial recognition at self-checkouts

#174

Post by nmeofthestate »

theamk wrote: post #11
usbpoet wrote: post #2

What's the purpose of the green square, anyways? Why not just have a regular camera feed?

Increase deterrence effect to scare away shoplifters. Home depot goes out of the way to make its cameras visible. There is a large "camera" sign, bright light to catch your attention, a visible display to show it's not a fake, and sometimes even a motion activated chime. I assume the green square around the face is the next step in a game.

>Increase deterrence effect to scare away shoplifters.

Exactly - these checkout monitors are positioned so you can see you're being filmed. I'm surprised the purpose of this is unclear to anyone.

Re: Home Depot sued for 'secretly' using facial recognition at self-checkouts

#175

Post by immibis »

andy99 wrote: post #173
ruszki wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

AFAIK improving on poverty is a more effective approach.

Is there evidence of that? That seems to have been the prevailing view over the last many years, and it's not clear to me that it's improved anything. There seems to be more homeless camps, more petty crime, more drugs.

Is it rich people in the homeless camps?

Re: Home Depot sued for 'secretly' using facial recognition at self-checkouts

#176

Post by 9cb14c1ec0 »

ruszki wrote: post #140
bmn__ wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

AFAIK improving on poverty is a more effective approach.

People from every socioeconomic level steal, and the motivations vary far more widely than simple need. It has much more to do with personal ethics than the amount of money you can afford to spend.

Re: Home Depot sued for 'secretly' using facial recognition at self-checkouts

#177

Post by benchly »

4ggr0 wrote: post #156
benchly wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I should have specified that I worked LP in the early 2000's but I doubt much has changed, since bigotry and racism do not seem to ever go away, especially when it's woven into the fabric of an institution. Lasted a mere 6 months at that job before I decided I could no longer turn a blind eye, since by then it had become clear to me that the problem was not isolated to just a few LP associates.

[flagged]

As an aside, this is not the first time I've seen a discussion (mine and your comments) about racism downvoted on HN. It makes me question the crowd I'm attempting to mingle with, here.

I get that the site is primarily concerned interesting tech-related things, but if anyone thinks that we can just avoid politics, social and economic issues that tend to surround those things once in awhile, they're delusional.

Re: Home Depot sued for 'secretly' using facial recognition at self-checkouts

#178

Post by nmeofthestate »

bgwalter wrote: post #12

Don't use self-checkouts. You do all the work, slower than the cashier, and are treated like cattle. Often there is a supervisor breathing down your neck and demanding the receipt before the exit doors open. Now there is facial recognition.

I'll keep using self-checkouts because they're fine and frequently faster than using a non-self-checkout. There are a few minor headaches like hair-trigger sensitivity of the weight sensors. I don't care in the slightest that a camera is filming to try to deter thieves - don't consider that a downside. The security measures are a bit depressing but only in what they say about where society is going with respect to theft from shops.

Re: Home Depot sued for 'secretly' using facial recognition at self-checkouts

#179

Post by immibis »

Ekaros wrote: post #81
cortesoft wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you have ANY evidence that sending someone to jail for a few months to a few years sets people on a straight path? I am pretty sure the evidence shows the opposite.

So why we are even using it anymore? Why not then close down all the prisons? If there is no deterrent effect or rehabilitation effect. Wouldn't it be greater savings just to close it all down and let everyone out?

The USA should do, perhaps, four fifths of that. Despite having 4% of the world's population it has 25% of the world's prisoners, and one of the highest crime rates in first-world countries so it'd obviously not working.

They could also consider banning substances that make people more aggressive... There's a particular artificial pesticide whose name I don't remember, which is coincidentally banned in all the places with much lower crime rates, and has been shown to alter behaviour in monkeys.

Re: Home Depot sued for 'secretly' using facial recognition at self-checkouts

#180

Post by 9cb14c1ec0 »

closewith wrote: post #149
bmn__ wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

> Put the criminals in prison. Do it often enough, and shoplifting ceases to be a problem of plague-like proportions. Big fan of accountability and immediate personal consequences and enforcing the law. This just doesn't work. A high-trust society cannot be built by force. > I am fatigued of the suicidal and deleterious empathy of those in charge who refuse to take second-order effects into account. The irony here is…

High trust societies can only exist when there are consequences for things like theft.
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