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'Reading crisis' prompts Denmark to end 25% tax on books

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Re: 'Reading crisis' prompts Denmark to end 25% tax on books

#11

Post by tossandthrow »

mlinhares wrote: post #5
Svip wrote: post #2

The way this article is worded makes it sound like Denmark has a 'book tax'. Denmark has a VAT on goods (and services), which is 25%. But Denmark doesn't have split VAT values, so it's either 25% or nothing; no in-between. So they are just proposing removing the VAT from books. (Some goods and services are already exempt from VAT.) And if you wonder why Denmark doesn't simply lower their VAT or introduce a split VAT…

Insane that technical debt and general incompetency in software can produce such unexpected side effects.

Why the general incompetency added on?

Ad the other commenter wrote: The 25% is assumed - this has nothing to do with competence but to what level an assumption is true.

Everybody can point fingers at 25 year old code and call the developers incompetent because surrounding requirements have changed.

Re: 'Reading crisis' prompts Denmark to end 25% tax on books

#12

Post by pmontra »

tossandthrow wrote: post #11
mlinhares wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Insane that technical debt and general incompetency in software can produce such unexpected side effects.

Why the general incompetency added on? Ad the other commenter wrote: The 25% is assumed - this has nothing to do with competence but to what level an assumption is true. Everybody can point fingers at 25 year old code and call the developers incompetent because surrounding requirements have changed.

Considering that's 25 year old code I'd expect at least a

  #define VAT 0.25
and not hardcoded values all around the source code. However I don't expect a table (db table, array, etc) of product categories with their own VAT code or a user defined exception list. That extra code would inevitably add bugs that are not worth the trouble. Adding an exception for books probably requires an update of the apps.

Re: 'Reading crisis' prompts Denmark to end 25% tax on books

#13

Post by [deleted] »

pmontra wrote: post #12
tossandthrow wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why the general incompetency added on? Ad the other commenter wrote: The 25% is assumed - this has nothing to do with competence but to what level an assumption is true. Everybody can point fingers at 25 year old code and call the developers incompetent because surrounding requirements have changed.

Considering that's 25 year old code I'd expect at least a #define VAT 0.25 and not hardcoded values all around the source code. However I don't expect a table (db table, array, etc) of product categories with their own VAT code or a user defined exception list. That extra code would inevitably add bugs that are not worth the trouble. Adding an exception for books probably requires an update of the apps.

[deleted]

Re: 'Reading crisis' prompts Denmark to end 25% tax on books

#14

Post by samdoesnothing »

I cannot believe there are people who expect the government to solve every problem when they can't even stop themselves from causing problems left right and centre. Even a child would make the correct inference that taxing books at 25% would not have a positive impact on reading rates. Boggles the mind really.

Re: 'Reading crisis' prompts Denmark to end 25% tax on books

#15

Post by blowfish721 »

Svip wrote: post #8
MathMonkeyMan wrote: post #4

Problem: 15 year olds don't know how to read. Solution: Make books 25% cheaper. Sure, it can't hurt, but are those kids or their parents gonna go out and buy books, and then, you know, learn how to read? I wonder what the numbers are like in the US...

This article[0], which covers the same but in Danish has more details. It mentions Sweden lowering their book VAT in 2001 to 6%. The takeaway was that more books were sold, but to people who were already buying books. Getting new readers thus requires an additional effort than merely lowering the cost. [0] https://www.dr.dk/nyheder/politik/regeringen-vil-afskaffe-mo...

Back then there were only linear tv and no social media. I know in my social circles back then in Sweden it was even trendy to read and lots of discussions between friends and even during family events between the teenagers about books. So yes it was a totally different landscape back then.

Re: 'Reading crisis' prompts Denmark to end 25% tax on books

#16

Post by uoaei »

Svip wrote: post #2

The way this article is worded makes it sound like Denmark has a 'book tax'. Denmark has a VAT on goods (and services), which is 25%. But Denmark doesn't have split VAT values, so it's either 25% or nothing; no in-between. So they are just proposing removing the VAT from books. (Some goods and services are already exempt from VAT.) And if you wonder why Denmark doesn't simply lower their VAT or introduce a split VAT…

What is the primary reason for hard-coding these kinds of things? Gotta imagine CScientists would have debated this during the design phase. I have some hypotheses, are any of these right?

* correctness/verifiability analyses

* security? in compiled tools (prevent malicious re-configuration)

* an assumption of the inertia of law

* general incompetence/naivete

???

Re: 'Reading crisis' prompts Denmark to end 25% tax on books

#17

Post by dsign »

They need to legalize the possession of birretudas:

https://w.ouzu.im/lit/birretuda

Seriously though, I think the problem is not so much the particular tax on books (though this measure would help) but the way those taxes are computed.

This is just a dumb idea, but if a company or a person has X amount of money to put into a product that then can be sold in essentially free-to-produce copies at a Y price, and then a consumer spends an amount of time Z consuming it, then there should be a tax computed on those three variables X, Y, Z. The idea being that huge actors with high X can end up having a lot of Z. And Z is citizen time, which is dangerous to let it be captured by the interests of big capital in detriment to the interests of lesser capital and other people. But I guess that sounds too socialist :-( .

Re: 'Reading crisis' prompts Denmark to end 25% tax on books

#18

Post by bruce511 »

pmontra wrote: post #12
tossandthrow wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why the general incompetency added on? Ad the other commenter wrote: The 25% is assumed - this has nothing to do with competence but to what level an assumption is true. Everybody can point fingers at 25 year old code and call the developers incompetent because surrounding requirements have changed.

Considering that's 25 year old code I'd expect at least a #define VAT 0.25 and not hardcoded values all around the source code. However I don't expect a table (db table, array, etc) of product categories with their own VAT code or a user defined exception list. That extra code would inevitably add bugs that are not worth the trouble. Adding an exception for books probably requires an update of the apps.

VAT is not a compile-time value. It's a runtime value. Nevermind not scattering it in your code, it shouldn't be in your code at all.

Re: 'Reading crisis' prompts Denmark to end 25% tax on books

#19

Post by kasperni »

Svip wrote: post #2

The way this article is worded makes it sound like Denmark has a 'book tax'. Denmark has a VAT on goods (and services), which is 25%. But Denmark doesn't have split VAT values, so it's either 25% or nothing; no in-between. So they are just proposing removing the VAT from books. (Some goods and services are already exempt from VAT.) And if you wonder why Denmark doesn't simply lower their VAT or introduce a split VAT…

> the answer is technical inertia (or technical debt, if you will)

One of the issues. There are number of others. For example, VAT is a value-based tax. A VAT cut gives the biggest savings to people who spend the most. Since wealthier people typically spend more, they would save more money in absolute terms. For example, a family with a food budget of 3,000 kr. would save 300 kr., while a family with a food budget of 8,000 kr. would save 800 kr. Politically, some parties might prefer tax breaks that focused on lower-income groups.

Another issue, will the cost savings actually be passed on to the consumer?

Re: 'Reading crisis' prompts Denmark to end 25% tax on books

#20

Post by throw748848485 »

tossandthrow wrote: post #11
mlinhares wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Insane that technical debt and general incompetency in software can produce such unexpected side effects.

Why the general incompetency added on? Ad the other commenter wrote: The 25% is assumed - this has nothing to do with competence but to what level an assumption is true. Everybody can point fingers at 25 year old code and call the developers incompetent because surrounding requirements have changed.

> and call the developers incompetent

Why would you blame developers for this?

This is management problem!

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