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Copilot broke audit logs, but Microsoft won't tell customers

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Re: Copilot broke audit logs, but Microsoft won't tell customers

#41

Post by [deleted] »

catmanjan wrote: post #36
lokar wrote: post #8

Wait, copilot operates as some privileged user (that can bypass audit?), not as you (or better, you with some restrictions) That can’t be right, can it?

As someone else mentioned the file isnt actually accessed by copilot, rather copilot is reading the pre-indexed contents of the file in a search engine... Really Microsoft should be auditing the search that copilot executes, its actually a bit misleading to be auditing the file as accessed when copilot has only read the indexed content of the file, I don't say I've visited a website when I've found a result of it in…

[deleted]

Re: Copilot broke audit logs, but Microsoft won't tell customers

#42

Post by lokar »

gpm wrote: post #40
Spooky23 wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, it accesses data with the users privilege.

Are you telling me I, a normal unprivileged user, have a way to read files on windows that bypasses audit logs?

I'm guessing they are making an implicit distinction between access as the user, vs with the privs of the user.

In the second case, the process has permission to do whatever it wants, it elects to restrain itself. Which is obviously subject to many more bugs then the first approach.

Re: Copilot broke audit logs, but Microsoft won't tell customers

#43

Post by ocdtrekkie »

jjkaczor wrote: post #35
lokar wrote: post #8

Wait, copilot operates as some privileged user (that can bypass audit?), not as you (or better, you with some restrictions) That can’t be right, can it?

So... basically like when Delve was first introduced and was improperly security trimming things it was suggesting and search results. ... Or ... a very long-time ago, when SharePoint search would display results and synopsis's for search terms where a user couldn't open the document, but could see that it existed and could get a matching paragraph or two... Best example I would tell people of the problem was users s…

I would say "insecure by default".

I talked to some Microsoft folks around the Windows Server 2025 launch, where they claimed they would be breaking more compatibility in the name of their Secure Future Initiative.

But Server 2025 will load malicious ads on the Edge start screen[1] if you need to access a web interface of an internal thing from your domain controller, and they gleefully announced including winget, a wondeful malware delivery tool with zero vetting or accountability in Server 2025.

Their response to both points was I could disable those if I wanted to. Which I can, but was definitely not the point. You can make a secure environment based on Microsoft technologies, but it will fight you every step of the way.

[1] As a fun fact, this actually makes Internet Explorer a drastically safer browser than Edge on servers! By default, IE's ESC mode on servers basically refused to load any outside websites.

Re: Copilot broke audit logs, but Microsoft won't tell customers

#44

Post by troad »

Microsoft's ham-fisted strategy for trying to build a moat around its AI offering, by shoving everyone's documents in it without any real informed consent, genuinely beggars belief.

It will not successfully create a moat - turns out files are portable - but it will successfully peeve a huge number of users and institutions off, and inevitably cause years of litigation and regulatory attention.

Are there no adults left at Microsoft? Or is it now just Copilot all the way up?

Re: Copilot broke audit logs, but Microsoft won't tell customers

#45

Post by dhosek »

ceejayoz wrote: post #11
lokar wrote: post #8

Wait, copilot operates as some privileged user (that can bypass audit?), not as you (or better, you with some restrictions) That can’t be right, can it?

> That can’t be right, can it? https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/james-franco-first-time

That was a laugh-out-loud moment in that film.

Re: Copilot broke audit logs, but Microsoft won't tell customers

#47

Post by faangguyindia »

lokar wrote: post #8

Wait, copilot operates as some privileged user (that can bypass audit?), not as you (or better, you with some restrictions) That can’t be right, can it?

I've disabled copilot i don't even find it useful. I think most people who use copilot have not see "better".

Re: Copilot broke audit logs, but Microsoft won't tell customers

#48

Post by troad »

heywire wrote: post #9

I am so tired of Microsoft cramming Copilot into everything. Search at $dayjob is completely borked right now. It shows a page of results, but the immediately pops up some warning dialog you cannot dismiss that Copilot can’t access some file “” or something. Every VSCode update I feel like I have to turn off Copilot in some new way. And now apparently it’ll be added to Excel as well. Thankfully I don’t have to use an…

> Every VSCode update I feel like I have to turn off Copilot in some new way.

This has genuinely made me work on switching to neovim. I previously demurred because I don't trust supply chains that are random public git repos full of emojis and Discords, but we've reached the point now where they're no less trustworthy than Microsoft. (And realistically, if you use any extensions on VS Code you're already trusting random repos, so you might as well cut out the middle man with an AI + spyware addiction and difficulties understanding consent.)

Re: Copilot broke audit logs, but Microsoft won't tell customers

#49

Post by TheRoque »

In my opinion, using AI tools for programming at the moment, unless in a sandboxed environment and on a toy project, is just ludicrous. The amount of shady things going on in this domain (AI trained on stolen content, no proper attribution, not proper way to audit what's going out to third party servers etc.) should be a huge red flag for any professional developer.

Re: Copilot broke audit logs, but Microsoft won't tell customers

#50

Post by TheRoque »

troad wrote: post #48
heywire wrote: post #9

I am so tired of Microsoft cramming Copilot into everything. Search at $dayjob is completely borked right now. It shows a page of results, but the immediately pops up some warning dialog you cannot dismiss that Copilot can’t access some file “” or something. Every VSCode update I feel like I have to turn off Copilot in some new way. And now apparently it’ll be added to Excel as well. Thankfully I don’t have to use an…

> Every VSCode update I feel like I have to turn off Copilot in some new way. This has genuinely made me work on switching to neovim. I previously demurred because I don't trust supply chains that are random public git repos full of emojis and Discords, but we've reached the point now where they're no less trustworthy than Microsoft. (And realistically, if you use any extensions on VS Code you're already trusting ran…

Same. Actually made me switch to neovim more and more. It's a great time to do so, with the new native package manager (now working in nightly 0.12)
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