Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Volkswagen locks horsepower behind paid subscription

autoexpress.co.uk

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

61–70 of 325 posts

Re: Volkswagen locks horsepower behind paid subscription

#61

Post by slt2021 »

degamad wrote: post #54
slt2021 wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

just multiply the monthly payment by 12*6 (avg time to own a car) and imagine giving the full amount upfront to the dealer for the full horsepower. I dont understand why people balk at car subscription for some feature, but perfectly fine with leasing a car => which is basically a car subscription driven to its logical end? does it matter if you have to pay $700 to your bank for lease and separately $20 to VW for som…

The difference is that the bank can't suddenly decide that you owe them $800 each month instead of $720, but VW can decide that your subscription costs $100 instead of $20.

because they can do, but doesn't mean they will do that.

You know what else VW can do: price each car at million dollar MSRP minimum, to make more money, but they dont do that. What do you think holds them from jacking up prices to $1 mln ?

Re: Volkswagen locks horsepower behind paid subscription

#62

Post by Esophagus4 »

austhrow743 wrote: post #49
buran77 wrote: post #24

I'm sure that by having fewer parts in the logistics chain they can build a car cheaper. They then define models via software almost for free. And that would be great if the saving was passed to the consumer. Instead every saving is definitely captured by the manufacturer and the consumer gets to buy a car that definitely does everything but "computer says no". But the situation is objectively worse than today becaus…

Why would this saving in particular get captured by the manufacturer?

I’ve always wanted to see the data for this.

Very curious to know - are the efficiencies of scale being passed on, or is this just additional revenue for manufacturers?

Re: Volkswagen locks horsepower behind paid subscription

#63

Post by jakub_g »

jackpeterfletch wrote: post #26
benji-york wrote: post #15

This makes sense to me. (Not that I would personally ever buy a car with that mechanism baked in.) They could either make two models (incurring the costs associated with having two different SKUs) and let people pay more for the one with more power or make one with intrinsically more power and let the people that don't want it pay less with it nerfed. I would have thought that people (like me) that have spent our liv…

This is quite common already, where they’ll offer a higher performance tier, but that power only comes from the engine control unit, no physical differences. It makes even more sense in EVs where you don’t have to be concerned with the performance of supporting components to the engine. The difference here, is that it’s a subscription, not a one time upgrade, and as a result, not an upgrade you can sell on.

> The difference here, is that it’s a subscription, not a one time upgrade, and as a result, not an upgrade you can sell on.

From the article, if you buy "lifetime" subscription, it persists.

> Auto Express, who first reported the story, said a lifetime subscription would be for the car rather than the individual - meaning the upgrade would remain on the car if it was sold on.

Re: Volkswagen locks horsepower behind paid subscription

#64

Post by mdp2021 »

tjwebbnorfolk wrote: post #44
mdp2021 wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> consumers do not necessarily act in the interest of consumers That's what I am saying with "broken market, broken supply-demand system, non-rational and non-informed economic agents". Bad products that sell are a reality since a long time.

Broken for whom? "Bad" according to whom? What would your goal be, then? Only "good" products are able to be sold -- according to whom will this definition of "good" be decided? I'm mainly playing devil's advocate here, but my point is that bringing value judgement into other people's decisions is not something I would regard as rational. People have their own reasons for doing things that I don't need to understand.

> whom?

Rational agents. That quality is an abater of relativism.

> What would your goal be, then

Livability. That requires working systems, so that choice is still possible. In the current situation, there is in many vast territories no choice, in many areas (not just cars), and greatly suboptimal, very thin livability.

Re: Volkswagen locks horsepower behind paid subscription

#65

Post by rkomorn »

abcd_f wrote: post #57
rvz wrote: post #2

Now you are seeing the great electric car scam - Selling you an under-powered electric car and to increase its power you must pay for a subscription to unlock it's full power capabilities. The best part is, many won't care (when they should). But these days, it is okay to get scammed isn't it? BMW tried selling a subscription on heated seats, but that failed. [0], So lets see how long this will last. [0] https://news…

BMW still sells a subscription to advanced headlight functions, live traffic info in their navigation and few other things. It's just now a packaged deal and they also opt you in by default into a three month trial. The car is also all but unusable without an online account, so there's that. Regrettably, despite of all the brouhaha with the heated seats, all this b/s never really went away.

At least the heated seats are "free"! [0]

(commented with the utmost sarcasm)

0- https://www.thedrive.com/news/bmw-is-giving-up-on-heated-sea...

Re: Volkswagen locks horsepower behind paid subscription

#66

Post by _aavaa_ »

lodovic wrote: post #43
_aavaa_ wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Now you are seeing the great electric car scam Keep your anti-EV hatred in check for a second and note that nothing in here is EV only. They could just as well do this with a gasoline car, that engine is also electronically controlled.

But you can replace the ECU in a gasoline powered car, or the entire engine if you want. You may have to recode some of the parts such as the headlights and the airbags. Often you can use parts from other brands. But replacing anything in an EV is a nightmare: all the parts, motor management, battery management, charging controller are tightly integrated, signed, coded to the car etc.

But that’s not because the car is an EV, that’s because the manufacturer is greedy.

The door handles, infotainment, tire pressure gauges, gas cap, etc. all could have a digital locks on them to bless them with DMCA protection.

Re: Volkswagen locks horsepower behind paid subscription

#67

Post by lonelyasacloud »

buran77 wrote: post #24

I'm sure that by having fewer parts in the logistics chain they can build a car cheaper. They then define models via software almost for free. And that would be great if the saving was passed to the consumer. Instead every saving is definitely captured by the manufacturer and the consumer gets to buy a car that definitely does everything but "computer says no". But the situation is objectively worse than today becaus…

> Instead every saving is definitely captured by the manufacturer and the consumer gets to buy a car that definitely does everything but "computer says no".

Or enabling full power puts more load on the vehicle's components and costs the manufacture more in warrant and reduced resale values.

Suspect it is a bit of both, but without access to the books.

Re: Volkswagen locks horsepower behind paid subscription

#68

Post by mdp2021 »

hinkley wrote: post #41
buran77 wrote: post #24

I'm sure that by having fewer parts in the logistics chain they can build a car cheaper. They then define models via software almost for free. And that would be great if the saving was passed to the consumer. Instead every saving is definitely captured by the manufacturer and the consumer gets to buy a car that definitely does everything but "computer says no". But the situation is objectively worse than today becaus…

So apparently we will download a car.

And (again) possess it but not own it.

Re: Volkswagen locks horsepower behind paid subscription

#69

Post by ozgrakkurt »

tjwebbnorfolk wrote: post #23
amelius wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Capitalism does not necessarily act in the interest of consumers, if that is what you were thinking.

If no one buys this car, making more of them will lose money until they stop. If consumers buy the car, then it will live on. In other words, CONSUMERS do not necessarily act in the interest of consumers.

If your choice is to get beaten or get sick then you can’t act in your interest.

Re: Volkswagen locks horsepower behind paid subscription

#70

Post by ExoticPearTree »

buran77 wrote: post #24

I'm sure that by having fewer parts in the logistics chain they can build a car cheaper. They then define models via software almost for free. And that would be great if the saving was passed to the consumer. Instead every saving is definitely captured by the manufacturer and the consumer gets to buy a car that definitely does everything but "computer says no". But the situation is objectively worse than today becaus…

Its a funny situation: they a put larger battery in the car, which makes the car heavier. Then they derate the battery to give you less mileage with the added “benefit” that you carry with you a deadweight that you can’t get rid of and contributes further to reduced mileage.

And someone at VW looked at this and said: amazing idea.

My single take from this is that batteries have become so cheap that you can put more in a car and still make a good profit.

It would have been nice if the savings would be passed on to the consumer.

Post reply on HN