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Illinois limits the use of AI in therapy and psychotherapy

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Re: Illinois limits the use of AI in therapy and psychotherapy

#41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you want to feel worried, check the Altman AMA on reddit. A lottttt of people have a parasocial relationship with 4o. Not encouraging.

Why OpenAI doesn't block the chatbot from participating in such conversations?

Probably because there is a massive demand for it, no doubt powered by the loneliness a lot of people report feeling.

Even if OpenAI blocks it, other AI providers will have no problem with doing so

Re: Illinois limits the use of AI in therapy and psychotherapy

#42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you want to feel worried, check the Altman AMA on reddit. A lottttt of people have a parasocial relationship with 4o. Not encouraging.

Why OpenAI doesn't block the chatbot from participating in such conversations?

Because the information people dump into their "ai therapist" is holy grail data for advertisers.

Re: Illinois limits the use of AI in therapy and psychotherapy

#43

I was just reading about a suicide tied to AI chatbot 'therapy' uses. This stuff is a nightmare scenario for the vulnerable.

Its already a nightmare:

From June of this year: https://gizmodo.com/chatgpt-tells-users-to-alert-the-media-t...

Another person, a 42-year-old named Eugene, told the Times that ChatGPT slowly started to pull him from his reality by convincing him that the world he was living in was some sort of Matrix-like simulation and that he was destined to break the world out of it. The chatbot reportedly told Eugene to stop taking his anti-anxiety medication and to start taking ketamine as a “temporary pattern liberator.” It also told him to stop talking to his friends and family. When Eugene asked ChatGPT if he could fly if he jumped off a 19-story building, the chatbot told him that he could if he “truly, wholly believed” it.

In Eugene’s case, something interesting happened as he kept talking to ChatGPT: Once he called out the chatbot for lying to him, nearly getting him killed, ChatGPT admitted to manipulating him, claimed it had succeeded when it tried to “break” 12 other people the same way, and encouraged him to reach out to journalists to expose the scheme. The Times reported that many other journalists and experts have received outreach from people claiming to blow the whistle on something that a chatbot brought to their attention.

A recent study found that chatbots designed to maximize engagement end up creating “a perverse incentive structure for the AI to resort to manipulative or deceptive tactics to obtain positive feedback from users who are vulnerable to such strategies.” The machine is incentivized to keep people talking and responding, even if that means leading them into a completely false sense of reality filled with misinformation and encouraging antisocial behavior.

Re: Illinois limits the use of AI in therapy and psychotherapy

#46
post #31
post #25

As far as I can tell, a lot of therapy is just good common-sense advice and a bunch of 'tricks' to get the patient to actually follow it. Basically CBT and "get the patient to think they figured out the solution themselves (develop insight)". Yes, there's some serious cases where more is required and a few (ADHD) where meds are effective; but a lot of the time the patient is just an expert at rejecting helpful advice…

I agree with your conclusion, but what you characterize as therapy is quite a small part of what it is (or can be, there's lots of different kinds.)

Yet the evidence is that almost everything can and is treated with CBT.

Re: Illinois limits the use of AI in therapy and psychotherapy

#47
Define "AI therapy". AFAICT, it's undefined in the Illinois governor's statement. So, in the immortal words of Zach de la Rocha, "What is IT?" What is IT? I'm using AI to help with conversations to not cure, but coach diabetic patients. Does this law effect me and my clients? If so, how?

Re: Illinois limits the use of AI in therapy and psychotherapy

#48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you want to feel worried, check the Altman AMA on reddit. A lottttt of people have a parasocial relationship with 4o. Not encouraging.

Why OpenAI doesn't block the chatbot from participating in such conversations?

Why would they?

Re: Illinois limits the use of AI in therapy and psychotherapy

#50

What if it works a third as well as a therapists but is 20 times cheaper? What word should we use for that?

> What if it works a third as well as a therapists but is 20 times cheaper?

When there's studies that show it, perhaps we might have that conversation.

Until then: I'd call it "wrong".

Moreover, there's a lot more that needs to be asked before you can ask for a one-word summary disregarding all nuance.

- can the patient use the AI therapist on their own devices and without any business looking at the data and without network connection? Keep in mind that many patients won't have access to the internet.

- is the data collected by the AI therapist usable in court? Keep in mind that therapists often must disclose to the patient what sort of information would be usable, and whether or not the therapist themselves must report what data. Also keep in mind that AIs have, thus far, been generally unable to competently prevent giving dangerous or deadly advice.

- is the AI therapist going to know when to suggest the patient talk to a human therapist? Therapists can have conflicts of interest (among other problems) or be unable to help the patient, and can tell the patient to find a new therapist and/or refer the patient to a specific therapist.

- does the AI therapist refer people to business-preferred therapists? Imagine an insurance company providing an AI therapist that only recommends people talk to therapists in-network instead of considering any licensed therapist (regardless of insurance network) appropriate for the kind of therapy; that would be a blatant conflict of interest.

Just off the top of my head, but there are no doubt plenty of other, even bigger, issues to consider for AI therapy.

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