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How to teach your kids to play poker: Start with one card

bloomberg.com

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Re: How to teach your kids to play poker: Start with one card

#61

Post by mcphage »

p1necone wrote: post #46
tetromino_ wrote: post #42

I have always been mystified by the popularity of poker. To me, it is an unpleasant game. First - the fact that it's played for real money. If I win, I feel like a common swindler stealing money that someone could use to pay their bills or buy something nice for themselves. If I lose, I feel like a swindler's victim. And if the people around the table happen to be my friends - why would I ever wish to victimize them,…

If you ignore the externalities of winning/losing money the thing that the betting brings to poker that is very hard to replace is the impact it has on the players decision making. People playing poker with "funny money" play the game fundamentally differently to the extent it's almost a different game (arguably worse, certainly less predictable) entirely. If you take the money out of it you have to replace it with s…

> I would argue that risk management is an interesting skill that's very hard to include in a game with perfect information.

I agree with you here quite strongly.

Re: How to teach your kids to play poker: Start with one card

#62

Post by mcphage »

cman1444 wrote: post #56
gretch wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You inferred it, but it's not implied. Instead of thinking of a bet as saying "I have good cards" think of it instead as "I have an advantage in this pot", which is not a lie. In poker advantages can come from cards, or from other objective measures such as position, stack size. And of course from subjective measures like being able to read your opponent.

But one of the most common strategies is to posture as if you have a good hand even though in reality you don't. That is deception.

Sure—but when you say it like that, suddenly it’s not a bad skill at all to tach your children, and teach them to be wary of others using it.

Re: How to teach your kids to play poker: Start with one card

#64

Post by sapphicsnail »

tetromino_ wrote: post #42

I have always been mystified by the popularity of poker. To me, it is an unpleasant game. First - the fact that it's played for real money. If I win, I feel like a common swindler stealing money that someone could use to pay their bills or buy something nice for themselves. If I lose, I feel like a swindler's victim. And if the people around the table happen to be my friends - why would I ever wish to victimize them,…

I think your 2nd reason is actually why poker is so popular. A lot of the joy of poker (at least for me) is trying to learn to read the other players. I generally play with friends and I find it emotionally intimate in a strange sort of way. Probably not for people who don't enjoy bluffing games though.

Edit: It's also a socially acceptable time to lie your ass off. Maybe it's a hit like how GTA is for some people as well.

Re: How to teach your kids to play poker: Start with one card

#65

Post by gretch »

cman1444 wrote: post #56
gretch wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You inferred it, but it's not implied. Instead of thinking of a bet as saying "I have good cards" think of it instead as "I have an advantage in this pot", which is not a lie. In poker advantages can come from cards, or from other objective measures such as position, stack size. And of course from subjective measures like being able to read your opponent.

But one of the most common strategies is to posture as if you have a good hand even though in reality you don't. That is deception.

The original claim is that people misconceive "that poker is about lying or that you need to lie to play poker"

The claim is not that deception can be used as a strategy at all. That btw is actually an uninteresting claim. In almost all games, you can lie to your opponent and probably gain some advantage.

If I were coaching a beginner poker player, I would honestly tell them to play statistically sound poker. That's a good way to make a lot of money.

Re: How to teach your kids to play poker: Start with one card

#66

Post by gretch »

c22 wrote: post #16
gretch wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You inferred it, but it's not implied. Instead of thinking of a bet as saying "I have good cards" think of it instead as "I have an advantage in this pot", which is not a lie. In poker advantages can come from cards, or from other objective measures such as position, stack size. And of course from subjective measures like being able to read your opponent.

If reading your opponent is a strategy that confers advantage then it stands to reason that deceiving your opponent is as well.

The original claim is that people misconceive "that poker is about lying or that you need to lie to play poker"

Just because other people may try to lie to you, does not mean that you need to lie in order to succeed.

No one said "lying can't be used at all"

Re: How to teach your kids to play poker: Start with one card

#67

Post by entropic88 »

nielsbot wrote: post #50
mrexroad wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Article footnote mentions this with the caveat that it requires some dexterity that young children may find challenging. That aside, I think the two games make a great complementary pair and switching between provides a nice contrast for kids.

I suppose you can simply hold your card in your hands with the back facing you. Or use some kind of vertical holder.

Like.. a headband?

Re: How to teach your kids to play poker: Start with one card

#69

Post by tzs »

tetromino_ wrote: post #42

I have always been mystified by the popularity of poker. To me, it is an unpleasant game. First - the fact that it's played for real money. If I win, I feel like a common swindler stealing money that someone could use to pay their bills or buy something nice for themselves. If I lose, I feel like a swindler's victim. And if the people around the table happen to be my friends - why would I ever wish to victimize them,…

What about other games that people play for real money where the money for the winners comes from the losers?

For example in amateur chess tournaments it is common for the prize money to come out of the entry fees. Fairly typical might be a $15 dollar entry fee in advance or $20 at the door, and a prize fund of $350 ($200 first, $100 second, $50 third) based on 30 entries. It will be lower if they get fewer entries, but let's say they get exactly 30. Then 3 players are going home with more than they came with. The other 27 are going home $15 or $20 in the hole.

Would you feel bad if you played in such a tournament and finished in the top 3? Some of the 27 losers might have had a better use for their entry fee.

Re: How to teach your kids to play poker: Start with one card

#70

Post by bawolff »

tetromino_ wrote: post #42

I have always been mystified by the popularity of poker. To me, it is an unpleasant game. First - the fact that it's played for real money. If I win, I feel like a common swindler stealing money that someone could use to pay their bills or buy something nice for themselves. If I lose, I feel like a swindler's victim. And if the people around the table happen to be my friends - why would I ever wish to victimize them,…

> Second - the lack of information. Many interesting games provide incomp9lete information of game state to the players, which one then needs to reconstruct. But with poker, the lack of information is so severe that one has no hope of reconstructing the game state - reasonable possibilities are too many to analyze, one is forced to pretty much guess and make gambles. It's an unpleasant experience.

Poker is basically the same type of game as "Among us". You might have some hints but you're not supposed to be able to entirely recreate the game state. If you can, the game is boring.

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