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Fight Chat Control

fightchatcontrol.eu

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Re: Fight Chat Control

#11

Post by cobbzilla »

croes wrote: post #10
cobbzilla wrote: post #8

Is Europe sliding into feudalism? The impression is that the government/megacorp complex are the lords, everyone else should accept their place as a serf and do whatever they’re told.

Where is the difference to the US, China or the UK? Governments often try that kind of nonsense. Usually against organized crime, terrorism, child abuse. But in the end it’s just used for the heavy crimes like copyright infringement

The US, at least, has a Bill of Rights that would make this illegal, it would definitely violate the 4th Amendment and maybe the 1st too.

Re: Fight Chat Control

#12

Post by [deleted] »

9dev wrote: post #4
isoprophlex wrote: post #2

God fucking damn it not again This is, what, the fifth time in ten years they try to pass shit like this?

They only need to succeed one time . People are generally preoccupied with a lot of other things right now, so maybe this is their lucky shot…

[deleted]

Re: Fight Chat Control

#13

Post by ronsor »

croes wrote: post #10
cobbzilla wrote: post #8

Is Europe sliding into feudalism? The impression is that the government/megacorp complex are the lords, everyone else should accept their place as a serf and do whatever they’re told.

Where is the difference to the US, China or the UK? Governments often try that kind of nonsense. Usually against organized crime, terrorism, child abuse. But in the end it’s just used for the heavy crimes like copyright infringement

The UK is politically, culturally, and geographically close to Europe.

China has always been authoritarian (and hyper-centralized).

The US is working hard to copy bad ideas from authoritarians, but can't do it in exactly the same way, otherwise the ability to criticize the EU, UK, and China is lost.

Re: Fight Chat Control

#14

Post by croes »

uncircle wrote: post #7
mantas wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As Juncker, ex president of European Commision said, you keep trying till it passes at some point. Good luck revoking it later…

Ah, the marvels of modern democracy. No serious way to enact change, politicians still do whatever the hell they want, and we still believe that voting for someone else will change things. It’ll soon be like the UK, that if you campaign against this kinda stuff, the party in power publicly calls you a paedophile. Because only people with something to hide want privacy. Privacy is a losing proposition. Governments hav…

People don’t want change.

If really someone gets the power who wants to change things they fight them too.

People want that everything stays the same. Problem is climate change and other problems make change inevitable.

Re: Fight Chat Control

#15

Post by Nifty3929 »

cobbzilla wrote: post #11
croes wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where is the difference to the US, China or the UK? Governments often try that kind of nonsense. Usually against organized crime, terrorism, child abuse. But in the end it’s just used for the heavy crimes like copyright infringement

The US, at least, has a Bill of Rights that would make this illegal, it would definitely violate the 4th Amendment and maybe the 1st too.

I hope you're right.

Re: Fight Chat Control

#16

Post by charcircuit »

mantas wrote: post #5
isoprophlex wrote: post #2

God fucking damn it not again This is, what, the fifth time in ten years they try to pass shit like this?

As Juncker, ex president of European Commision said, you keep trying till it passes at some point. Good luck revoking it later…

You can keep trying to revoke it until it passes too.

Re: Fight Chat Control

#17

Post by calvinmorrison »

uncircle wrote: post #7
mantas wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As Juncker, ex president of European Commision said, you keep trying till it passes at some point. Good luck revoking it later…

Ah, the marvels of modern democracy. No serious way to enact change, politicians still do whatever the hell they want, and we still believe that voting for someone else will change things. It’ll soon be like the UK, that if you campaign against this kinda stuff, the party in power publicly calls you a paedophile. Because only people with something to hide want privacy. Privacy is a losing proposition. Governments hav…

it effects lots of organizations. the left contingent of the PCUSA basically did the same for a decade to change rules. When they finally got the language passed it caused a large rift.

The difference is that one is not obligated to be part of a presbytery and can leave. The presbytery doesn't have guns.

Re: Fight Chat Control

#18

Post by morkalork »

mantas wrote: post #6
ath3nd wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They generally don't and won't stop until there are real repercussions for that, like losing your political career/being canceled in society over voting for it.

The problem is people behind the curtains will just pick another figure head. And we can’t even get the names who want to get rid of privacy. Since names of people pushing it were redacted for their privacy :D

When the people orchestrating something like this can hide behind a veil of anonymity as well as bestow exemptions from monitoring upon the political class, it looks deeply wrong and conspiracy worthy. :D indeed.

Re: Fight Chat Control

#19

Post by cobbzilla »

cobbzilla wrote: post #11
croes wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where is the difference to the US, China or the UK? Governments often try that kind of nonsense. Usually against organized crime, terrorism, child abuse. But in the end it’s just used for the heavy crimes like copyright infringement

The US, at least, has a Bill of Rights that would make this illegal, it would definitely violate the 4th Amendment and maybe the 1st too.

That said, it’s not all roses in the US. There are many backdoors the government uses like issuing subpoenas to tech companies to get their data. Sometimes (like the notorious NSLs, National Security Letters) the order is secret and the company can’t even talk about it. This is also why the Snowden revelations were significant— arguably what the NSA is doing (mass, untargeted surveillance) is illegal, but so far (iirc) courts have said nobody has standing to challenge it. Various groups are still trying.

Re: Fight Chat Control

#20

Post by pmlnr »

ronsor wrote: post #13
croes wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where is the difference to the US, China or the UK? Governments often try that kind of nonsense. Usually against organized crime, terrorism, child abuse. But in the end it’s just used for the heavy crimes like copyright infringement

The UK is politically, culturally, and geographically close to Europe. China has always been authoritarian (and hyper-centralized). The US is working hard to copy bad ideas from authoritarians, but can't do it in exactly the same way, otherwise the ability to criticize the EU, UK, and China is lost.

> The UK is politically,

Europe generally has constitutions, and not precedence laws, which is a massive difference.

> culturally

Debatable. As a Hungarian, living in the UK.

> and geographically close to Europe

This one is true.

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