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Poorest US workers hit hardest by slowing wage growth

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191–200 of 354 posts

Re: Poorest US workers hit hardest by slowing wage growth

#191
post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The numbers get better as they get more data.

Why not wait to release them until enough data has come in that it's settled? Serious question, what's the downside?

It’s never settled as the data is never perfectly accurate or exhaustive. We just have to do with the caveats and understand that perfection does not exist, even if you have more data than you can handle. That’s what error bars, uncertainty analysis, and confidence intervals are for.

Re: Poorest US workers hit hardest by slowing wage growth

#192
post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I genuinely wonder what you've done over the last few years. Rising salaries will lead to inflation. Expecting anything else is fantasy

> Rising salaries will lead to inflation. Expecting anything else is fantasy No. Riding salaries do not lead to inflation by themselves. What leads to inflation is the increase in money circulating on the market. In other words: printing money leads to inflation.

> Riding salaries do not lead to inflation by themselves. What leads to inflation is the increase in money circulating on the market

Not necessarily, if price of product A goes up and I have to buy that it means I have less money to spend on product B. Meaning demand on product B goes down so its price goes down.

If we go back to the point that we're talking about, being how it affects the lowest incomes, then you can see how an ever increasing % of their income is locked up in food/housing etc.

By your logic "What leads to inflation is the increase in money circulating on the market." Why is the rate of inflation even a value that isn't known beforehand? Surely we control our own printers, no?

Re: Poorest US workers hit hardest by slowing wage growth

#194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, for two reasons. The first is that Americans often refuse to work those jobs (and for good reason, they pay incredibly poorly, have no benefits etc. It is generally a financial loss to do said jobs). We've tried multiple times to try and get Americans to work in the fields: it never works [1]. The second is that a large amount of our economy is heavily subsidized by said cheap immigrant labor and if you just stra…

> The first is that Americans often refuse to work those jobs (and for good reason, they pay incredibly poorly, have no benefits etc. It is generally a financial loss to do said jobs). Would Americans work those jobs if those jobs paid well?

Those jobs can not pay well, because the basic living goods have to be artificially price dumped to remain affordable for the working poor. Otherwise all prices would have to be raised to include this, which will never happen.

Re: Poorest US workers hit hardest by slowing wage growth

#195

Poorest workers are hit hardest by pretty much anything related to money.

Including tariffs. (Blanket) tariffs are almost like a special tax on poor people. Explanation: to a well off person, 25% higher gas or food prices is just an annoyance. Nothing in their day to day life will change because of that. To a poor person it's brutal.

And, importantly, tariffs are payed by the importing party. This means they affect the base price of the product and cannot be made progressive.

You could set up a deduction system... But that's retroactive (poor people still don't have that money for a whole year) and dramatically complicates their tax filing burden and financial record keeping requirements.

The rich can afford lawyers and accountants, so the IRS has been going after lower and lower income folk for their slip-ups more often. So yet more punishing the poor.

Re: Poorest US workers hit hardest by slowing wage growth

#196
post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're missing an important piece here. The lower your income is, the bigger the % you spend on necessities like food. So when those go up, the lower incomes are again hit the hardest as they spend a higher percentage of their total income on it. And these are necessities not nice to haves

> You're missing an important piece here. I am not. You are confusing transient effects with the equilibrium state. Btw, for low wage employees everything is a significant % of their wage. The only meaningful way to increase their wages is to decrease the supply of cheap labor. This is exactly what happened during Covid where no one was willing to work for $8/hr and the wages went up. When people realize that their w…

Supply and demand aren't always in the same place...

If a lot of the farm workers in California are gone how does that help the people in Nevada or Michigan that are unemployed... You think they're going to fill those positions?

> When people realize that their wage doesn’t guarantee good living they will look for a better job or demand a raise

Wow... When your job requires no education or training? I guess everyone who works 2 or more jobs in the us needs to talk to you. They're all missing this obvious point.

Re: Poorest US workers hit hardest by slowing wage growth

#197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Nobody said printing money can’t cause inflation. You said in the comment above.

> You said in the comment above How do you read “price levels are a function of both money demand and money supply” and get that? Going back to the top, you claimed “riding [ sic ] salaries do not lead to inflation.” That is nonsense. Even if we ignore that rising salaries cause the money supply to increase through increased velocity, wealth effect and credit creation. (This is why when the economy is strong central…

> You have to destroy money to make up for the money being created by the private sector.

In other words, to keep inflation at bay, one of the things you do, you restrict money supply.

Re: Poorest US workers hit hardest by slowing wage growth

#198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Are you from the future? …we are currently in the future of the previous tariffs. Also, come on, you’re yourself arguing these tariffs aren’t worth betting on. What do you think investing in a factory is?

> …we are currently in the future of the previous tariffs. Which ones? > Also, come on, you’re yourself arguing these tariffs aren’t worth betting on. What do you think investing in a factory is? I can’t bet on negotiation tactic, only on the outcomes and formal agreements. As soon as those would be finalized we would know. Now we do not know how the trade policy would look like. I would assume that investment banker…

> Which ones?

Liberation Day.

> can’t bet on negotiation tactic, only on the outcomes and formal agreements

How about money actually invested [1][2].

[1] https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/C307RX1Q020SBEA

[2] https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/C307RX1Q020SBEA

Re: Poorest US workers hit hardest by slowing wage growth

#199
post #25

> Pay for the top 25 per cent of workers is up by 4.7 per cent in the year to June Wait what? Anyone here getting 4.7% pay rises?

Ofcourse. That's what unions do. It's also why inflation is so damn nefarious because unions ALWAYS negotiate a pay rise to match it. Which as you can imagine gets very ugly fast.

Re: Poorest US workers hit hardest by slowing wage growth

#200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You said in the comment above How do you read “price levels are a function of both money demand and money supply” and get that? Going back to the top, you claimed “riding [ sic ] salaries do not lead to inflation.” That is nonsense. Even if we ignore that rising salaries cause the money supply to increase through increased velocity, wealth effect and credit creation. (This is why when the economy is strong central…

> You have to destroy money to make up for the money being created by the private sector. In other words, to keep inflation at bay, one of the things you do, you restrict money supply.

> to keep inflation at bay, one of the things you do, you restrict money supply

Again, nobody said money supply doesn’t affect price levels. But in this example, rising wages caused the inflationary impetus without any money printing. To correct for that, the money supply must be reduced.

If you’re piloting a plane, deflecting the control surfaces will move the plane. But so will winds. If winds buffet your plane you have to deflect control surfaces to get back to where you were. That doesn’t mean the wind doesn’t exist.

Rising salaries can cause inflation all on their own. Even in an economy with a fixed money supply. (So can printing money, but nobody was debating that.)

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