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Vibe coding is the fast fashion industry of software engineering

pdelboca.me

41–50 of 74 posts

Re: Vibe coding is the fast fashion industry of software engineering

#41
I think it's revealing that a group that historically values making decisions based on verifiable and accurate information is now jumping to discredit "Vibe Coding" based on rumors that are easily disproven.

1. Tea App wasn't vibe coding - It was built before vibe coding and the leak was incorrectly secured Firebase https://simonwillison.net/2025/Jul/26/official-statement-fro...

2. Replit "AI Deleted my Database" drama was caused by guy getting inaccurate AI support. All he needed to do was click a "Rollback Here" button to instantly recover all code and data. https://x.com/jasonlk/status/1946240562736365809

What does this eagerness to discredit vibe coding say about us?

Re: Vibe coding is the fast fashion industry of software engineering

#42
post #37

It seems to me that the ongoing “vibe coding” debate on HN, about whether AI coding agents are helpful or harmful, often overlooks one key point: the better you are as a coder, the less useful these agents tend to be. Years ago, I was an amazing C++ dev. Later, I became a solid Python dev. These days, I run a small nonprofit in the digital rights space, where our stack is mostly JavaScript. I don’t code much anymore,…

I think it's the opposite , the better you are as a coder and know your domain, the better you can use ai tools. someone with no expertise is set up for failure

Totally agree. I see LLM assistance as a multiplier on top of your existing expertise. The more experience you have the more benefit you can get.

Re: Vibe coding is the fast fashion industry of software engineering

#43
post #22

Why do you think AI is producing low quality code? Before I started using AI, my code was often rejected as "didn't use thing X" or "didn't follow best practice Y" but ever since I started coding with AI, that was gone. Works especially well when the code is being reviewed by a person who is clueless about AI.

> Why do you think AI is producing low quality code? I asked for a very, very simple bash script to test code generation abilities once. The AI got it spectacularly wrong. So wrong that it was ridiculous. Here's my reason why I think it does produce low quality code; because it does.

I feel like sooner or later the standard for these types of discussions should become:

> "Here's a link to the commits in my GitHub repo, here's the exact prompts and models that were used that generated bad output. This exact example proves my point beyond a doubt."

I've used Claude Sonnet 4 and Google Gemini 2.5 Pro to pretty good results otherwise, with RooCode - telling it what to look for in a codebase, to come up with an implementation plan, chatting with it about the details until it fills out a proper plan (sometimes it catches edge cases that I haven't thought of), around 100-200k tokens in usually it can knock out a decent implementation for whatever I have in mind, throw in another 100-200k tokens and it has made the tests pass and also written new ones as needed.

Another 200k-400k for reading the codebase more in depth and doing refactoring (e.g. when writing Go it has a habit of doing a lot of stuff inline instead of looking at the utils package I have, less of an issue with Spring Boot Java apps for example cause there the service pattern is pretty common in the code it's been trained on I'd reckon) although adding something like AI.md or a gradually updated CODEBASE.md or indexing the whole codebase with an embedding model and storing it in Qdrant or something can help to save tokens there somewhat.

Sometimes a particular model does keep messing up, switching over to another and explaining what the first one was doing wrong can help get rid of that spiraling, other times I just have to write all the code myself anyways because I have something different in mind, sometimes stopping it in the middle of editing a file and providing additional instructions. On average, still faster than doing everything manually and sometimes overlooks obvious things, but other times finds edge cases or knows syntax I might not.

Obviously I use a far simpler workflow for one off data transformations or knocking out Bash scripts etc. Probably could save a bunch of tokens if not for RooCode system prompt, that thing was pretty long last I checked. Especially good as a second set of eyes without human pleasantries and quick turnaround (before actual human code review, when working in a team), not really nice for my wallet but oh well.

Re: Vibe coding is the fast fashion industry of software engineering

#44

I think it's revealing that a group that historically values making decisions based on verifiable and accurate information is now jumping to discredit "Vibe Coding" based on rumors that are easily disproven. 1. Tea App wasn't vibe coding - It was built before vibe coding and the leak was incorrectly secured Firebase https://simonwillison.net/2025/Jul/26/official-statement-fro... 2. Replit "AI Deleted my Database" dra…

It's just human nature. Technology advances exponentially and huge leaps forward are increasingly being compressed into very short amounts of time. Just like how sages were worried about memory after the invention of writing or luddites were worried about job displacement with the industrial revolution; it is natural. What would the Italian Renaissance artists think of Photoshop? People whose livelihood and identity are inherently tied to this discipline can't help but be dismissive. "Vibe Coding" will be "coding" or "programming" in the near future, likely in just a few years as tools evolve. Just like we use text editors and GUIs now to do computing instead of punch cards and a single CLI.

Re: Vibe coding is the fast fashion industry of software engineering

#45
On a plane from Sydney to Tokyo. Just "vibe coded" a tool we've needed for years in a matter of hours. Web workers, OPFS file management, e2e tests via playwright, Effect service encapsulation and mocking etc.

If you know the domain it's a 3-6X efficiency improvement.

Amazing how well LLMs work on airplane wifi. Just text after all.

Re: Vibe coding is the fast fashion industry of software engineering

#46

Why do you think AI is producing low quality code? Before I started using AI, my code was often rejected as "didn't use thing X" or "didn't follow best practice Y" but ever since I started coding with AI, that was gone. Works especially well when the code is being reviewed by a person who is clueless about AI.

This is because AI-generated code will always be mediocre. There is so much poor-quality code in the training base that it will dilute the high-quality sources. AI is not a craftsman who builds on his own high standards, but rather a token grinder tool calibrated to your prompts. Even if you describe your problem (prompt) to a high standard, there is no way it can deliver a solution of the same standard. This will be…

I just don't think that's true.

The LLM vendors are all competing on how well their models can write code, and the way they're doing that is to refine their training data - they constantly find new ways to remove poor quality code from the training data and increase the volume of high quality code.

One way they do this is by using code that passes automated tests. That's a unique characteristic of code - you can't do that for regular prose, or legal analysis or whatever.

"Even if you describe your problem (prompt) to a high standard, there is no way it can deliver a solution of the same standard."

My own experience doesn't match that. I can describe my problems to a good LLM and get back code that I would have been proud to have written myself.

Re: Vibe coding is the fast fashion industry of software engineering

#47
post #22

Why do you think AI is producing low quality code? Before I started using AI, my code was often rejected as "didn't use thing X" or "didn't follow best practice Y" but ever since I started coding with AI, that was gone. Works especially well when the code is being reviewed by a person who is clueless about AI.

> Why do you think AI is producing low quality code? I asked for a very, very simple bash script to test code generation abilities once. The AI got it spectacularly wrong. So wrong that it was ridiculous. Here's my reason why I think it does produce low quality code; because it does.

How long ago? What model? How did you prompt it?

Re: Vibe coding is the fast fashion industry of software engineering

#48
post #20
post #12

Vibe coding is not a 0/1 skill. LLMs generate code as the prompt says, so when you ask what you want, you get it. If you want a specific pattern or architecture, explicitly ask for that. It works really well when you (not the LLM) drive the development.

Wasn't the original definition of vibe coding asking us to "forget that the code even exists"?

It was, but annoyingly a lot of people now use "vibe coding" to mean any form of AI-assisted development.

It's got to the point where if someone talks about "vibe coding" you have to confirm with them which definition they are using, because otherwise you risk people talking right past each other because they're not actually talking about the same thing.

Re: Vibe coding is the fast fashion industry of software engineering

#49
post #42
post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's the opposite , the better you are as a coder and know your domain, the better you can use ai tools. someone with no expertise is set up for failure

Totally agree. I see LLM assistance as a multiplier on top of your existing expertise. The more experience you have the more benefit you can get.

Indeed, I can predict a huge gulf between pre-vibe senior engs and post-vibe lazy learners: the seniors get massive amplification and meanwhile those on the ground floor are not learning, and even gradually loose what little they did learn
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