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How to make websites that will require lots of your time and energy

blog.jim-nielsen.com

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Re: How to make websites that will require lots of your time and energy

#221

Post by Xss3 »

indigo945 wrote: post #204
sherburt3 wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At least when I see raw sql I know me and the author are on a level playing field. I would rather deal with a directory full of sql statement that get run than some mysterious build tool that generates sql on the fly and thinks its smarter than me. For example, I'm working on a project right now where I have to do a database migration. The project uses c# entity framework, I made a migration to create a table, realiz…

You can use EF by writing the migrations yourself ("database first"). Also, whatever problem you have there seems to be easily fixed either by a better understanding of how EF's code generation works, or by more aggressive use of version control.

Their point is they understand sql and dbs. They shouldnt need to learn EF and all its footguns.

Re: How to make websites that will require lots of your time and energy

#222

Post by austin-cheney »

brokegrammer wrote: post #216

1. Dependencies break your project only if added unpinned. Most modern package managers will pin dependencies for you. Now, what if a dependency does break? Well, you can replace it with another dependency, or you can write one from scratch. Using dependencies allows you to save time earlier, and then only spend time writing your own libraries once you hit a roadblock. 2. Frameworks are similar to dependencies. They…

Your comment reads like someone who deliberately does not measure things to avoid confrontations against your conveniences and biases.

For example modern compilation may very well be faster than in the past, but your application and experience could be still even faster without compilation.

Frameworks also come at a substantial cost. They are highly restrictive, super massive, and almost always unnecessary. I can understand why people use them, but again your application and experience could be dramatically faster without them. People tend to prefer frameworks when they lack the confidence to build without them, but for those of us that frequently measure things large frameworks are always a net negative.

Re: How to make websites that will require lots of your time and energy

#223

Post by teddyh »

jimniels wrote: post #178
card_zero wrote: post #3

I enjoyed the concept of "a complication step". Can't see the results of changes until my code has finished complicating.

Author here: I didn’t realize that misspelling until now. But I like it. Gonna leave it. Thanks for pointing it out ha!

The medium is the massage.

Re: How to make websites that will require lots of your time and energy

#224

Post by Xss3 »

listenallyall wrote: post #194
about3fitty wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can unironically imagine legitimate use cases for this idea. I’d wager that many DBs could fit unnoticed into the data footprint of a modern SPA load.

Yes, probably a lot of storefronts could package up their entire inventory database in a relatively small (comparatively) JSON file, and avoid a lot of pagination and reloads. Regardless, my comment was, of course, intended as sarcasm.

Stream the db to the clients post page load and validate client requests against a cache on the server.

Re: How to make websites that will require lots of your time and energy

#225

Post by pluto_modadic »

sjducb wrote: post #218
skinkestek wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People love to rant about ORMs. But as someone who writes both raw SQL and uses ORMs regularly, I treat a business project that doesn’t use an ORM as a bit of a red flag. Here’s what I often see in those setups (sometimes just one or two, but usually at least one): - SQL queries strung together with user-controllable variables — wide open to SQL injection. (Not even surprised anymore when form fields go straight into…

100% If a dev thinks that all SQL can be written by hand then they probably haven’t worked with a complex application that relies on complex data. A good question to ask them is: what problems do ORMs solve? Good answers are: Schema Changes + migration Security Code Traceability (I have a DB field, where is it used) Code Readability Standardisation - easy hiring. Separation of data layer logic and application layer l…

I like Django's ORM for good schema migration. Other "ORMs" people build do not often have a good story around that. So often it's because developers aren't experiencing the best ORMs they could.

Re: How to make websites that will require lots of your time and energy

#226

Post by bapak »

namenotrequired wrote: post #95
bapak wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Correct. It's broken by default because you're the only user and worked on it for 10 minutes 5 years ago. Probably wrote no tests for it. Compare that to something like jQuery where all the edge cases have already been accounted for 10 years ago.

If I worked on it for 10 minutes 5 years ago then it’s definitely not taking lots of time and energy

As far as you know.

People who don't "over engineer" also don't track errors. So you might be losing a bunch of users because your website is broken on their devices, and you'll never know. You can't repro it because your locale doesn't match theirs.

Re: How to make websites that will require lots of your time and energy

#227

Post by sjducb »

pluto_modadic wrote: post #225
sjducb wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

100% If a dev thinks that all SQL can be written by hand then they probably haven’t worked with a complex application that relies on complex data. A good question to ask them is: what problems do ORMs solve? Good answers are: Schema Changes + migration Security Code Traceability (I have a DB field, where is it used) Code Readability Standardisation - easy hiring. Separation of data layer logic and application layer l…

I like Django's ORM for good schema migration. Other "ORMs" people build do not often have a good story around that. So often it's because developers aren't experiencing the best ORMs they could.

Homegrown ORMs are universally terrible and a lot of the anti ORM crowd are really anti homegrown ORM.

I’ve used Django, SQLalchemy and Hibernate. All three have good migration stories.

Re: How to make websites that will require lots of your time and energy

#228

Post by DecoySalamander »

socalgal2 wrote: post #212
rckt wrote: post #33

The post feels more like a rant, like the author has a beef with some sort of a project or a client. Even a static blog is easier to manage with tools rather than writing it in pure HTML. I have my personal website running on svelte. When I decided to have a blog, I quickly came up with a solution to use markdown to html converter and just added a couple of routes to existing setup and voila, the blog is up and runni…

I have a personal web app that I wrote in react 16 with babel set up by createReactApp directly from the react docs. it’s been stuck with a list of features I want to add in my spare time but all 3 of those have bitrotted out so that in my minor spare time over the last 2 years or so, instead of being able to add some feature, I spend 2 to 3 hours trying to update it to the latest, fail, and no progress is made. my l…

I think you will have a much better time if you generate a new, empty React project with Vite and just drop your existing components into it. I almost suggested not updating at all and keeping your dependencies as they are, but createReactApp was too much of a bloated mess even in its heyday.

Re: How to make websites that will require lots of your time and energy

#230

Post by benchloftbrunch »

brabel wrote: post #53
iLoveOncall wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Neither do your dependencies. Unless the maintainer somehow hacks into your server and updates them for you?

People in web development tend to allow dependencies to auto-update. It’s kind of a necessary evil in that the alternative is to do it only manually and then falling behind on security vulnerabilities updates and potentially getting hacked.

While ironically leaving themselves open to supply chain attacks.
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