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Britain's spies-for-hire are running wild

politico.eu

31–40 of 67 posts

Re: Britain's spies-for-hire are running wild

#31
post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a very off topic tangent, but that makes me quite curious. What is the difference between "veterans" and "retired military personnel"?

“Retired military personnel” have completed their 20+ years of service and retired with full pension. “Veteran” refers to anyone who has served in the armed forces.

Ahhh, right. I guess that'a a distinction that makes sense. Thanks.

Re: Britain's spies-for-hire are running wild

#32
post #15

> Private intelligence firms claim that illegally obtained information is routinely submitted to courts in the U.K., with the third industry figure telling POLITICO there are “ludicrous cover stories put in front of judges” where people are trying to “launder stolen information into court proceedings.” This sounds like "parallel construction" with fewer steps.

Outsourced parallel construction. The world seems to be moving away from long-established (and established slowly over a long time) rules and regulations around law and due process due to it feeling slow and inconvenient. Haven't crime rates been declining in the West for quite a while now?

>Haven't crime rates been declining in the West for quite a while now?

Yes but not for the reasons you think. More crime is going unreported, unsolved, unenforced than ever before. It started during Covid and hasn’t really gotten any better. The Leo’s that are die hard are now out there wearing masks looking for people of a specific skin color.

Re: Britain's spies-for-hire are running wild

#33
post #6

> [The company] appointed investigative agencies to surveil me, initially covertly and then overtly with vehicles and cameras placed outside my house. Isn't that just stalking? Why didn't they just call the cops?

I'm guessing because none of it happened. Seriously an anonymous client, talking about an anonymous company, hiring another anonymous company, stating that a credible professional (the senior lawyer) said it was a big issue but not actually confirming with the lawyer that they knew of this case and had said that?

In these cases, if you speak too much you get killed.

I'll post one such case to corroborate the article, since it was big news in my community: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024_Hong_Kong_trade_office_sp...

Allegedly involved are Hong Kong government, multiple private security and private investigators from the UK with ex-military/law enforcement background, and a mysterious death after the whole scandal was exposed.

Which sounds exactly like what the article is describing.

Re: Britain's spies-for-hire are running wild

#34
post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a very off topic tangent, but that makes me quite curious. What is the difference between "veterans" and "retired military personnel"?

“Retired military personnel” have completed their 20+ years of service and retired with full pension. “Veteran” refers to anyone who has served in the armed forces.

So if you only did 10 years and have military skills this regulation does not apply?

Re: Britain's spies-for-hire are running wild

#35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Outsourced parallel construction. The world seems to be moving away from long-established (and established slowly over a long time) rules and regulations around law and due process due to it feeling slow and inconvenient. Haven't crime rates been declining in the West for quite a while now?

>Haven't crime rates been declining in the West for quite a while now? Yes but not for the reasons you think. More crime is going unreported, unsolved, unenforced than ever before. It started during Covid and hasn’t really gotten any better. The Leo’s that are die hard are now out there wearing masks looking for people of a specific skin color.

Any source for that?

Many say the opposite. Crimes are more often reported especially if suspects have a „specific skin color“.

Re: Britain's spies-for-hire are running wild

#36
post #4

Bit of a mess of an article IMHO. Intelligence agency staff leave their roles, just like anyone else does. Unregulated? They're as regulated as the rest of us. Then you have the article casting aspersions on them for doing so, it must be about money and malign foreign influences. Of course foreign states use proxies; so does the UK. Why's that even mentioned as if it's implying ex-intel staff are the proxies - which…

I have no idea how regulated “the rest of us are.” This brush-off does not convince me that private spying is good, or that regulations are sufficient to stop it. In fact, the existence of an article in Politico makes me strongly suspect this is part of a discussion in which someone argues for more regulation. Fortunately I don’t live in the UK. Unfortunately I’m not convinced that is a barrier. ETA: the argument “wh…

I don't buy that it's work traditionally reserved for governments, or that it's all bad.

There are people offering their services to find kidnapped children, I struggle to see that as a bad thing. Private investigatory work has a long history in the country of Sherlock Holmes (or at least Dr Joseph Bell). You have figures as far back as Harry Philby flirting with foreign governments after their time within the UK government.

They're not offering government services, they're offering their own capabilities.

Re: Britain's spies-for-hire are running wild

#38
post #15

> Private intelligence firms claim that illegally obtained information is routinely submitted to courts in the U.K., with the third industry figure telling POLITICO there are “ludicrous cover stories put in front of judges” where people are trying to “launder stolen information into court proceedings.” This sounds like "parallel construction" with fewer steps.

Outsourced parallel construction. The world seems to be moving away from long-established (and established slowly over a long time) rules and regulations around law and due process due to it feeling slow and inconvenient. Haven't crime rates been declining in the West for quite a while now?

Other than a few small relative blips like we had around 2020 and other big events, crime rates have been falling since around the 1400s across the western world, regardless of how stringent or lax law enforcement has been. It is near a worldwide phenomenon other than places experiencing a total collapse of local government or active war.

Re: Britain's spies-for-hire are running wild

#39
post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Haven't crime rates been declining in the West for quite a while now? Yes but not for the reasons you think. More crime is going unreported, unsolved, unenforced than ever before. It started during Covid and hasn’t really gotten any better. The Leo’s that are die hard are now out there wearing masks looking for people of a specific skin color.

Any source for that? Many say the opposite. Crimes are more often reported especially if suspects have a „specific skin color“.

There's really no way to know so it's silly to ask for a source. The only crime statistic that's fairly reliable (at least in developed countries) is murder because it's hard to hide a body. Lesser crimes are heavily under reported but no one knows by how much, and the reporting rates vary widely by location and time. In many places the police actively discourage victims from reporting minor crimes because it creates more work for them and looks bad in their statistics.

Re: Britain's spies-for-hire are running wild

#40
post #4

Bit of a mess of an article IMHO. Intelligence agency staff leave their roles, just like anyone else does. Unregulated? They're as regulated as the rest of us. Then you have the article casting aspersions on them for doing so, it must be about money and malign foreign influences. Of course foreign states use proxies; so does the UK. Why's that even mentioned as if it's implying ex-intel staff are the proxies - which…

It is POLITICO. Always a mess of emotional appeal and misty allegations trying to launder editorials as 'news'.

Run their articles through NLP and ask about facts and cited evidence to support those facts and most of the time their will be 'very' little. Ask which type of audience the articles are written for, and you will find the writing style alligns with an audience driven by emotional appeal rather than fact or reason.

And yes, most of our media has devolved in the same way, but nearly every time I come across a POLITICO article, it seems to go out of its way to confirm this and then some.

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