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When we get Komooted

bikepacking.com

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Re: When we get Komooted

#221

Post by Sammi »

baq wrote: post #103
bremon wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a warning: every time I’ve pushed hard, then had to rein it in and do less, I’ve gotten fired. There’s nothing you can do that makes you irreplaceable, even if you’re the only one in the world that can do it. It’s fine if you want to stay in your happy place as the only one that can do X and then keep selling them on the value you provide and how you’re doing big things. But, nothing lasts. Don’t burn out, but sit…

Don’t do that then. Work on 90% with bursts of 130%. Don’t work on 120% all the time because it’ll be assumed you’ve gotten lazy when you just need to slow down.

Those percentages are all too high for a normal salery.

Re: When we get Komooted

#222

Post by smsm42 »

That's why I am so reluctant to participate in "community-driven" projects anymore. I don't even mind people making money from my free contributions. But if they eventually sell it to a bunch of private equity piranhas, which would just cannibalize it for spare parts, suck out all the brand value and leave the carcass rotting - why should I be a part of it? I am glad to contribute my work to the society, with no compensation but feeling good about it. But enriching some random private equity dude and then letting it all burn - why bother?

Re: When we get Komooted

#223

Post by farfromrefuge »

If anyone is interested i develop a free and open source alternative to komoot. I am currently using it for a 6 months trip in Europe : https://github.com/Akylas/alpimaps The idea of it is to be able to do everything offline, from map browsing to route computing, elevation profile... I am 99% sure i use the same library for route computing which is the amazing Valhalla computing framework. It propose multiple routes likes komoot, can show route stats, compute elevation profiles. But it can also do much more like compute different ascents or show slopes percentages without online data.

To use the full potential of AlpiMaps you need to generate your maps. I can generate them but i dont have the fundings to host the maps on a server (would need a lot of space and computing power to regularly generate maps per country, per regions ...). Instead i explain how to generate the maps for any region you see fit.

Also AlpiMaps has a very small user panel right now so it had many bugs i am sure (especially on iOS which i dont use daily). I am though 100% willing to fix/improve/add any feature. Just share/explain on github.

I am not often on HN so if you have any question please use github

Re: When we get Komooted

#224

Post by maqnius »

BozeWolf wrote: post #3

I felt betrayed as well. Just paid €30,- the month or so before because I liked the app and the service, but I also needed more maps. It offered great value to me. If I knew 80% of the employees would be fired, inevitably leading to a degrading service, I would have never done that. It is weird, but I do not trust the app any more in planning routes either. Sometimes i have the feeling bugs in the planning part alrea…

I'm really happy with locus maps 3 classic in combination with brouter as a local routing engine with my own routing profile using my preferences.

In combination with downloadable map tiles, I can plan and ride my route completely offline which saves battery and keeps things running in the more rural areas.

The route planner is really nice. I actually plan all my routes in the smartphone and export to gpx if necessary because it's the most comfortable way to do it.

What I also really appreciate is, that it's not a subscription based payment model. So you pay once for downloadable tiles etc. and for the app and can just use it without worrying about updated terms etc.

BUT, and that's a major BUT, the version is deprecated and will be ended soon in favour of the subscription based locus map 4. I don't miss anything in locus map 3 and don't see any benefits. I'll just hope the app will work as long as possible without official support.

Re: When we get Komooted

#225

Post by baq »

sneak wrote: post #160
jodrellblank wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why do people with families to feed and 20-30 year mortgages desire more than a week of job stability when it can take months to find work again? Is this a serious question?

Yes, absolutely. If you have a family and a mortgage without first having enough savings to support those things through anomalies, you’re acting irresponsibly. Nobody should be expecting their employer (or any second party, really) to be their income stream’s low pass filter. That’s what your savings account is for. If you can’t support your family and mortgage through 6-9 months (minimum) out of savings, you should…

> If you have a family and a mortgage without first having enough savings to support those things through anomalies, you’re acting irresponsibly.

Or maybe it’s the collective us acting irresponsibly because how you get young people to start families if it’s irresponsible until biologically too late?

Re: When we get Komooted

#226

Post by Doctor_Fegg »

rglullis wrote: post #218
Doctor_Fegg wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They had 250 employees, plus paid influencers, for a (predominantly) cycle routing app used in Europe. That’s why it was unsustainable. A realistic sized business would have been sustainable.

Which is why I mentioned the issue of scale . Seems like you are agreeing with me?

Absolutely yes. Just expanding on the point that the "scale" in question was how Komoot chose to run their operations, not the size of customer base addressed. Bending Spoons have, quite adroitly, figured that they can serve 90% of the customer base with 10% of the operations costs.

Re: When we get Komooted

#227

Post by pydry »

appreciatorBus wrote: post #183
pydry wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You could equally argue that there is no point making murder illegal because "all the same dynamics leading to murder" will still happen. They will. Society exists to either curtail or encourage our instincts for a collective purpose. This is not about that. This about an institution being rewarded and operating entirely within the law which takes a valuable asset, systematically disenfranchises the people who made i…

You’ve moved the goal posts. First, we were talking about an outcome – exploitation of workers. Your claim, if I understand you correctly is that this outcome is inevitable under capitalism, (perhaps solely possible under capitalism?) and then under some other system you prefer, it would no longer happen, or perhaps be impossible. My contention is the incentive to exploit exists in all socioeconomic systems, even col…

No. You moved the goal posts actually.

We werent talking JUST about an outcome, we were talking about a process triggered by private equity that destroys value AND exploits workers and rewards the people who do it.

Re: When we get Komooted

#228

Post by joshvm »

Zeebrommer wrote: post #198
navane wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The users were always the real service provider. All the value is in what they tell each other through their data. All Komoot does is aggregate it, supply the infra structure. The only way to stop owners pulling the rug underneath all this community given content is by keeping the content open source. Promise the users you will do best with their data by keeping it out in the open so that if you don't, someone else w…

Is someone even trying to open source that type of content (routes, pois)?

Open Street Map.

But otherwise this is really something that tourist organisations could champion, in combination with national mapping services. It's not like the routes are somehow obscure, or user-generated they're often national trails strung together. Switzerland Mobility is a good example of this. You can also hook official weather providers. The fact that we need private apps is bizarre.

https://schweizmobil.ch/en/switzerlandmobility-app

Re: When we get Komooted

#229

Post by const_cast »

michaelt wrote: post #77
lycopodiopsida wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is nothing unethical about: you are doing the only sane thing in this system and economics. Morons, who work themselves to death believing bosses shit-talk about “our mission” and “we are in this together” will learn it the hard way.

In principle, we can imagine jobs that contribute positively to the world. When a builder builds a house, or a doctor mends a broken arm, the community has one more home and one less broken arm - and the community is left richer even after the builder and doctor have been paid. That house will be keeping a family warm and dry 20, 40, 100 years into the future, and the patient will be using that arm for the rest of th…

The unfortunate reality is that a lot of jobs don't exist to enrich the community, they exist for the exact opposite purpose. They exist to make the world a worse place. They exist to make people sicker, or cause more children to die, or maybe even to accelerate acts of war.

You don't need to do good things to make money. You can do bad things and make lots of money, and actually, that's typically a little easier. You can even create your own unique evils and then sell solutions to them.

Re: When we get Komooted

#230

Post by const_cast »

nradov wrote: post #197
oezi wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because in Europe we believe that with ownership also come responsibilities. For instance to care about your employees, prevent destruction of nature, etc. Things you can wrap in insane complex laws or just manage through a social contract between the tarif partners (employees and employers). We all lose if this contract is broken.

Don't presume to speak for "Europe". It's a big place with a wide diversity of viewpoints. We all lose when employers have a paternalistic relationship with employees. It's better for everyone to keep things strictly transactional.

It's not an equal transaction - it's like a child negotiating with an evil sorcerer.

The reality is that you have little to no power or leverage in labor relationships. You may think you do, because it is very valuable to the other party for you to believe as such. But you do not.

Things being purely transaction can work when it's a fair transaction. When your life is on the line and the other party is risk fuck-all, it's not a fair transaction. When you have a few sheckles at your disposal and the other party has billions, it's not a fair transaction. When you don't know shit about their decision making but the other party knows as much as possible as they can about you, it's not a fair transaction.

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