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What went wrong inside recalled Anker PowerCore 10000 power banks?

lumafield.com

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Re: What went wrong inside recalled Anker PowerCore 10000 power banks?

#141

Post by nomel »

delfinom wrote: post #131
phil21 wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep. Anything I get from China, even from a vendor I have done lots of business with in the past gets at minimum random samples inspected and tested when appropriate. Every single shipment, zero exceptions before use. So many things are caught. At best there is a lack of QA on the Chinese side, but it's definitely worse than that. They have no qualms sending you known-bad items, and just see it as "maybe the customer…

>A lot of folks used to living in a high trust society get really taking advantage by this. Everything you describe happens even with US suppliers. Dealing with one right now that sent us sheet metal that was painted + silkscreened incorrectly (a very large symbol was completely dropped by them). They proceeded to "refinish" them, wrong by silkscreening a second time which completely degraded the quality of smaller t…

> This US supplier is charging us for every single bit of their incompetence.

I don't think that's entirely fair, since there's definitely some naivety here. "What happens if there's a mistake" needs to be the first thing you ask, when working with anyone. If you don't, you've both agreed to an uncomfortable argument, when things go wrong. Get it out of the way at the beginning, but expect to pay a little more for not relying on hopes and dreams of perfection.

And, there's a good chance that if you read the fine print, you explicitly agreed to this.

Re: What went wrong inside recalled Anker PowerCore 10000 power banks?

#142

Post by Dylan16807 »

gosub100 wrote: post #128
devmor wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Your only option is to run. That is not true. Please don't spread misinformation that could lead to deaths or people losing everything they own. You can put out a Lithium battery fire with a class-D fire extinguisher. If you don't have one available, you can isolate the burning battery by surrounding it with sand or other inert, dry substances to keep it from spreading until the fire department arrives with proper…

You forgot having a fume hood, or halon foam system. Or just a silver heat resistant suit and SCBA. Please don't hold back on the pedantry and "you can"s. People might miss these valuable options and not know they can just coexist with the lithium fire right next door!

Are you trying to imply that "sand or other inert, dry substances" are too exotic to be in an average house?

Also you can keep things near the battery wet.

Re: What went wrong inside recalled Anker PowerCore 10000 power banks?

#143

Post by hn_acc1 »

y7r4m wrote: post #67
Zak wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wish more devices took field-replaceable cylindrical Li-ion cells. They're pretty common in flashlights and rare in other products where they would be advantageous.

It would be awesome if we were able to get more things besides vapes (and apparently some flashlights; I assume there are many niches where they are common) to use 18650 or even 21700 li-ion cells. I see most people I know buy AAs by the pallet and go through them regularly for their controllers, led lights, kids toys, etc.. and few I believe bother to dispose of them correctly. Also, repeating your sentiment, for al…

If you can replace the battery, they can't sell you a new one.

Re: What went wrong inside recalled Anker PowerCore 10000 power banks?

#144

Post by nfriedly »

godelski wrote: post #76

First off, I love Luma Field. Always incredible to see what's going on inside things. Even just fun to scroll through their Twitter. Second, Anker is one of the few companies I actually have a very high trust for. A few years back I bought a wall charger[0] from them, it has 2 USB-C and a Type A. A month in, one of the Type-C ports wouldn't charge if the other port was being used. If you send a support ticket they an…

I feel like a lot of people have stories like this about Anker, which makes me think they have good customer service, but shit quality.

Re: What went wrong inside recalled Anker PowerCore 10000 power banks?

#145

Post by mr_toad »

scq wrote: post #88
yegle wrote: post #21

FWIW this has caused a big storm in China. The root of the issue is known to be caused by the battery cell vendor Amprius changing the battery design w/o notifying the power bank manufacturers. AFAIKT Amprius lost the 3C certification (a certification in China) because of this incident. This is one of the Chinese reports on the issue: https://m.thepaper.cn/newsDetail_forward_31048287 Excerpt from the report above (tr…

Amprius has released a statement: > Amprius Technologies, Inc. has never developed or manufactured batteries for power banks. For accuracy, please attribute the certification issue to Apex (Wuxi), not Amprius. Recent reports have incorrectly linked Amprius Technologies, Inc. to a battery certification issue. The company involved is Apex (Wuxi) Co., Ltd., formerly known as Amprius (Wuxi) Co., Ltd., a Chinese lithium b…

Shenanigans.

Re: What went wrong inside recalled Anker PowerCore 10000 power banks?

#146

Post by Chachichichi »

nomel wrote: post #52
yegle wrote: post #21

FWIW this has caused a big storm in China. The root of the issue is known to be caused by the battery cell vendor Amprius changing the battery design w/o notifying the power bank manufacturers. AFAIKT Amprius lost the 3C certification (a certification in China) because of this incident. This is one of the Chinese reports on the issue: https://m.thepaper.cn/newsDetail_forward_31048287 Excerpt from the report above (tr…

I work in manufacturing in the US. Incoming quality control, for Chinese vendors, is necessarily set up with zero-trust. This isn't a "trust but verify" sort of thing, it's strictly "do not trust". Assume that, at every step of the chain, there will be a lie: change of process, material change, collected data, and that the product being given to you is even yours (delivering a knockoff at the final step, and resellin…

To me they're still doing a "trust but verify" system. Zero trust would mean not trusting them with their products at all and moving manufacturering elsewhere. It sounds like Anker skimped on verification and they're paying the price.

Re: What went wrong inside recalled Anker PowerCore 10000 power banks?

#147

Post by Clamchop »

y7r4m wrote: post #67
Zak wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wish more devices took field-replaceable cylindrical Li-ion cells. They're pretty common in flashlights and rare in other products where they would be advantageous.

It would be awesome if we were able to get more things besides vapes (and apparently some flashlights; I assume there are many niches where they are common) to use 18650 or even 21700 li-ion cells. I see most people I know buy AAs by the pallet and go through them regularly for their controllers, led lights, kids toys, etc.. and few I believe bother to dispose of them correctly. Also, repeating your sentiment, for al…

I didn't know many were still buying alkaline AAs in large quantities. I've been using LSD NiMH AAs and AAAs for I think more than 15 years and haven't looked back. They seem to work with everything.

Re: What went wrong inside recalled Anker PowerCore 10000 power banks?

#148

Post by acdha »

bboygravity wrote: post #119
phil21 wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep. Anything I get from China, even from a vendor I have done lots of business with in the past gets at minimum random samples inspected and tested when appropriate. Every single shipment, zero exceptions before use. So many things are caught. At best there is a lack of QA on the Chinese side, but it's definitely worse than that. They have no qualms sending you known-bad items, and just see it as "maybe the customer…

I don't get how it's possible that nobody (other than Tesla) can manufacture batteries in the West? It a glance this feels insane. Batteries are in everything and such a basic need. How is it possible that buying through known scammers with tons of QA is still cheaper than manufacturing in the West? Obviously for Tesla it isn't cheaper to buy from China, so why is it thought to be cheaper for the rest of the West? Is…

Tesla buys most of their batteries from Japanese and Chinese companies like Panasonic and CATL. Some of those are assembled in factories like the Nevada gigafactory where Panasonic runs part of the factory. They’ve struggled with quality and capacity issues, which I think really just hits the idea that China spent decades on infrastructure and it’ll take similar amounts of time to catch up.

Re: What went wrong inside recalled Anker PowerCore 10000 power banks?

#149

Post by joecool1029 »

djmips wrote: post #108
joecool1029 wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> if they are LiFePO No phones use this chemistry. I have no idea what you're on about. >Wouldn't be the first time I've seen something with no over or undervolt protection whatsoever. Even the cheapest lithium ion charge controllers have overvolt protection by the nature of how they work. What can happen however is a controller could be specced to charge to 4.3V per cell and a 4.2V cell is instead installed. This is…

>> if they are LiFePO > No phones use this chemistry. I have no idea what you're on about. I thought we were discussing a power bank not a phone.

They made the claim manufacturers used batteries that were old stock for phones. Again, I don't know what they are on about.

Re: What went wrong inside recalled Anker PowerCore 10000 power banks?

#150

Post by ramses0 »

turnsout wrote: post #43
Pxtl wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honestly, when shopping no-name slop I'm seeking out products that don't have batteries, or at least don't have powerful ones (non-vibrating game controllers are probably pretty safe). One less risk.

100%... I'm seeking products that take AA or AAA batteries instead of built-in lithium batteries, for the same reason.

Same, but different. I have bought maybe hundreds of rechargeable AA/AAA batteries over the last ten years, and chased as exclusively as possible devices without built-in rechargeable batteries.

Anything with a built-in battery is nearly always e-waste within 3 years, while I've had AA/AAA devices that are 5-10 years old that are fine.

Pop the batteries out when in storage, never need to wait for it to recharge (just rotate in new batteries), use disposable batteries from the corner shop in an emergency.

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