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UK backing down on Apple encryption backdoor after pressure from US

arstechnica.com

191–200 of 438 posts

Re: UK backing down on Apple encryption backdoor after pressure from US

#191

What could go wrong? The UK is the same country that arrests 12,000 people a year for posting online. > Now every force in the country has a team sifting through people’s posts trying to determine what crosses an undefined threshold. “It is a complete nightmare,” one officer admits Britain’s police are restricting speech in worrying ways https://www.economist.com/britain/2025/05/15/britains-police... From The Economi…

12k a year?!? That is a staggering number. I wonder what the stats were in East Germany (though they may have had harsher punishments.. that can be ratcheted up later though once the system is in place)

It's mostly far-right shit-stirring because it's a much broader set of crimes than you are being led to believe. It's basically every possible crime "by communication":

"A spokeswoman for Leicestershire police said crimes under Section 127 and Section 1 include “any form of communication” such as phone calls, letters, emails and hoax calls to emergency services."

I expect it's mostly domestic abuse cases because what was once screamed through a closed door is now messaged online.

When a family member starts threatening others, an arrest is probably the necessary intervention to prevent actual violence. It's a similar story in cases like e.g. community racial tensions and gang violence. Once the threats are happening online, real violence is imminent and action warranted.

Re: UK backing down on Apple encryption backdoor after pressure from US

#192

What could go wrong? The UK is the same country that arrests 12,000 people a year for posting online. > Now every force in the country has a team sifting through people’s posts trying to determine what crosses an undefined threshold. “It is a complete nightmare,” one officer admits Britain’s police are restricting speech in worrying ways https://www.economist.com/britain/2025/05/15/britains-police... From The Economi…

[citation needed], your Economist article [0] quotes 30 a day (which would be > Under these laws, British police arrest more than 30 people a day for online posts, double the rate in 2017. Some are serious offenders, such as stalkers.

How many of those 30 were for "online posts" (and of which nature - Lucy Connolly is a favourite example cited by the likes of Vance, but she was arrested for trying to stir up racial tension when there were already race riots going on)? Who can tell, because the article didn't seem to bother asking.

0: For anyone curious, https://archive.ph/vaCkJ#selection-1287.0-1298.0

Re: UK backing down on Apple encryption backdoor after pressure from US

#193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US succeeded, according to American lawmakers: https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2023/12/apple-admits-to-... Apple has since confirmed in a statement provided to Ars that the US federal government "prohibited" the company "from sharing any information," but now that Wyden has outed the feds, Apple has updated its transparency reporting and will "detail these kinds of requests" in a separate section on push noti…

Apple and Google had no choice but to comply with the National Security Letters demanding access to user's push notification data. They also can't refuse to comply with warrants demanding any such unencrypted data that is stored on their servers. That's not the same thing as adding a back door to allow access to encrypted user data that is stored on the user's device. It's also different than storing encrypted user d…

You'd better hope you're right. Nobody is auditing Apple who can hold them accountable. The lack of transparency is how we ended up on this slippery slope in the first place.

Good security models typically don't hinge on being lucky.

Re: UK backing down on Apple encryption backdoor after pressure from US

#194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You only require AWS if you build something to run on AWS. That's the thing. You can easily run it on something else, just build it for that specifically. Now, AWS-style services have become somewhat of an industry standard (e.g. S3 offered by countless operators). But still, I think offering AWS style services is a weakness because you can never become better than the original. And cloud is only really cost-effectiv…

Netflix as the canonical example would beg to differ as would Apple who hosts plenty of its services between AWS, GCP and I believe Azure. I only know first hand about AWS since Apple talked about it during ReInvent. There are plenty of large private corporations and governments who host on AWS. Maybe they didn’t do it naively?

Netflix mainly runs from caching boxes at ISPs though. Most of their content comes from there. AWS is way too expensive to serve all that content from.

I see a lot of dumb implementations. At work we're picking up all our physical servers and moving them to AWS compute boxes that run 24/7. Purely statically, just because our idiot CIO wants to be a "cloud-driven company" so he can spout the buzzwords. We're spending a lot more money to get the same only on someone else's computers and get none of the actual benefits that cloud can offer.

Re: UK backing down on Apple encryption backdoor after pressure from US

#195

What could go wrong? The UK is the same country that arrests 12,000 people a year for posting online. > Now every force in the country has a team sifting through people’s posts trying to determine what crosses an undefined threshold. “It is a complete nightmare,” one officer admits Britain’s police are restricting speech in worrying ways https://www.economist.com/britain/2025/05/15/britains-police... From The Economi…

> The UK is the same country that arrests 12,000 people a year for posting online.

I though it could not be true, but actually it is...WTF?

https://www.europarl.europa.eu/doceo/document/E-10-2025-0022...

Re: UK backing down on Apple encryption backdoor after pressure from US

#196
post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not extraordinary at all. Ron Wyden, a US Senator subject to special briefings, basically repeated the same thing when asked about federal backdoors: "As with all of the other information these companies store for or about their users, because Apple and Google deliver push notification data, they can be secretly compelled by governments to hand over this information," Wyden wrote. https://arstechnica.com/tech-po…

Push notifications for e2e messaging apps carry e2e encrypted payload, which can’t be decrypted unless Apple reads the private keys from those apps sandboxes…

In the case of iMessage/iCloud, it seems like that already happens: https://s3.documentcloud.org/documents/21114562/jan-2021-fbi...

Re: UK backing down on Apple encryption backdoor after pressure from US

#197
post #192

What could go wrong? The UK is the same country that arrests 12,000 people a year for posting online. > Now every force in the country has a team sifting through people’s posts trying to determine what crosses an undefined threshold. “It is a complete nightmare,” one officer admits Britain’s police are restricting speech in worrying ways https://www.economist.com/britain/2025/05/15/britains-police... From The Economi…

[citation needed], your Economist article [0] quotes 30 a day (which would be > Under these laws, British police arrest more than 30 people a day for online posts, double the rate in 2017. Some are serious offenders, such as stalkers. How many of those 30 were for "online posts" (and of which nature - Lucy Connolly is a favourite example cited by the likes of Vance, but she was arrested for trying to stir up racial t…

Ridiculous thing to say when any number north of 0 is too many. But go ahead, muddy an otherwise extraordinarily simple argument.

Re: UK backing down on Apple encryption backdoor after pressure from US

#199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple and Google had no choice but to comply with the National Security Letters demanding access to user's push notification data. They also can't refuse to comply with warrants demanding any such unencrypted data that is stored on their servers. That's not the same thing as adding a back door to allow access to encrypted user data that is stored on the user's device. It's also different than storing encrypted user d…

You'd better hope you're right. Nobody is auditing Apple who can hold them accountable. The lack of transparency is how we ended up on this slippery slope in the first place. Good security models typically don't hinge on being lucky.

Nobody is auditing Google to prove that they aren't selling user data to third party data brokers.

Should we disbelieve them when they say they don't do so?

Re: UK backing down on Apple encryption backdoor after pressure from US

#200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US succeeded, according to American lawmakers: https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2023/12/apple-admits-to-... Apple has since confirmed in a statement provided to Ars that the US federal government "prohibited" the company "from sharing any information," but now that Wyden has outed the feds, Apple has updated its transparency reporting and will "detail these kinds of requests" in a separate section on push noti…

Apple and Google had no choice but to comply with the National Security Letters demanding access to user's push notification data. They also can't refuse to comply with warrants demanding any such unencrypted data that is stored on their servers. That's not the same thing as adding a back door to allow access to encrypted user data that is stored on the user's device. It's also different than storing encrypted user d…

To clarify: When you get an NSL, not only is it impossible to refuse and stay in business, it is also impossible to talk about it. That's the scary bit.
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