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George Gilder: Capitalism is based on information and knowledge, not greed

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Re: George Gilder: Capitalism is based on information and knowledge, not greed

#12
I'm not sure this random collection of quotes is a great starting point for a discussion as broad as what "capitalism is". Especially quotes that come in an election year from a non-economist mainly famous for his GOP activism.

If you do want an argument in favor of the information-aggregation view of markets, and what is required for them to work in practice, F.A. Hayek provides a better analysis.

Re: George Gilder: Capitalism is based on information and knowledge, not greed

#13
post #5

"In capitalism, the winners do not eat the losers but teach them how to win through the spread of information." This certainly casts patents in an anti-capitalist light...

I don't actually agree with that. Capitalism is ruthless. The winners do put the losers out of business. That's the moral justification for IP: without regulatory intervention, the winners are often not the generators of the IP. That has become more true in the age of the Internet, where a lot of natural monopolies are emerging, but it was probably always true. Size begets growth, coalition-building is inevitable (leading to conglomerates) and those who can't make nice with the big players often get crushed.

The problem with capitalism is that it's not stable. People who become rich and powerful (and their generally useless heirs, friends, and hired-gun managers) don't actually want to live in a capitalist world, so they use their social connections to build a private safety net, which hampers innovation. Corporate bureaucracies have more in common with the Kremlin than a Silicon Valley startup, and even Silicon Valley isn't that innovative, because it's increasingly controlled by a well-connected VC/media social elite. Most people wouldn't want to live in pure capitalism, and the corporate elite especially doesn't want it. They want to keep what they've got.

The problem with the problem with capitalism (or the problem with not-capitalism) is that every alternative to an at least mostly capitalistic economy is terrible. Command economies are not desirable.

Most thinking people are essentially (small-l) libertarian. My use of this word has nothing to do with the current usage (conservative who likes pot). By libertarian, I mean the opposite of authoritarian: belief that people should, all else being equal, be free to do as they wish rather than controlled by a governmental or corporate authority. (Authoritarians believe it's intrinsically impossible for most people to do anything good unless told to do so by a central authority.) The problem is that libertarianism begets capitalism begets conglomeration begets corporatism. It's the Iron Law of Oligarchy. The only solution I can see is the Western European social democracy (i.e. a socialist infrastructure to provide a safety net, but a capitalist engine for innovation and to maintain individual freedom). You need enough of a welfare state to keep people from being exploited by emergent corporate power, but enough capitalism (economic freedom) to keep innovation alive.

Re: George Gilder: Capitalism is based on information and knowledge, not greed

#15
"Far from a system of greed, capitalism depends on a golden rule of enterprise: The good fortune of others is also your own."

So... when competition puts your company out of business, that's a good thing?

It was beneficial to local grocers when their businesses were bankrupted after being undercut by Walmart?

Re: George Gilder: Capitalism is based on information and knowledge, not greed

#16

I'm not sure this random collection of quotes is a great starting point for a discussion as broad as what "capitalism is". Especially quotes that come in an election year from a non-economist mainly famous for his GOP activism. If you do want an argument in favor of the information-aggregation view of markets, and what is required for them to work in practice, F.A. Hayek provides a better analysis.

Thanks, have you found that Hayek incorporates technology and the flow of technological knowledge? I'd love to see a ref on that. I recommend checking out the book The Origin of Wealth as one ref that has a nice coverage of tech/knowledge in a behavioral economics context.

Re: George Gilder: Capitalism is based on information and knowledge, not greed

#17

"Far from a system of greed, capitalism depends on a golden rule of enterprise: The good fortune of others is also your own." So... when competition puts your company out of business, that's a good thing? It was beneficial to local grocers when their businesses were bankrupted after being undercut by Walmart?

Yes, it gave them an impulse to find areas where they could do something that people judged valuable enough to part with their money. (e.g. learn how to design web pages and make bad flash animations ;)

It also did help people who buy groceries, including poor people.

Re: George Gilder: Capitalism is based on information and knowledge, not greed

#18

Capitalism is based on there being a customer. All the capital in the world doesn't do any good if there's not a buyer on the other end. Another argument for a strong middle class.

The idea that the upper class depends on the middle class is false. Establishment and talent are natural enemies. I would like to see us destroy the upper class (maybe "dismantle" is a better word; I don't see violent revolution producing anything good) and build a society that is robust against social elites and upper-class parasitism-- ideally a society where there are no entrenched social classes-- but I'm probably dreaming on that one.

Yes, they need a healthy middle class if they want to keep a capitalist economy going. Here's the depraved little secret: they don't actually care that much about having a capitalist economy.

Social elites are almost always parasitic and actually quite non-ideological. If we were a communist or fascist state, it'd be the same people in charge, but instead of being corporate executives, they'd be government bureaucrats. They don't give a shit about "capitalism" or "socialism" so long as it's them on top. The ideology is something they tune to the peasants' shifting tastes.

It's not about economic well-being for them. It's about status. In a robust capitalist and technological economy, they get private jets. If the U.S. becomes Third World, they get white maids. Both are essentially status symbols, and they don't have an intrinsic attachment to one over the other, but they'd rather reign in hell than serve in heaven.

Re: George Gilder: Capitalism is based on information and knowledge, not greed

#19

"Far from a system of greed, capitalism depends on a golden rule of enterprise: The good fortune of others is also your own." So... when competition puts your company out of business, that's a good thing? It was beneficial to local grocers when their businesses were bankrupted after being undercut by Walmart?

Yes, it gave them an impulse to find areas where they could do something that people judged valuable enough to part with their money. (e.g. learn how to design web pages and make bad flash animations ;) It also did help people who buy groceries, including poor people.

But now the people who worked at the small town grocer are out of a job, so you are left with more poor people.

Re: George Gilder: Capitalism is based on information and knowledge, not greed

#20

Capitalism has its problems, but its critical selling point is that, if it works well, you don't need official approval to do business. In the USSR, it was a crime to compete with the one established business: the state. Fusions of state and business power (whether from the left, as in communism, or from the right, as in fascism) are almost always bad. The major win (practical and moral) in capitalism is the right of…

Actually, during Stalin times, the state delegated substantial part of no-high tech production to cooperative businesses ("артели"). Only later the system turned into a monolithic state monopoly.
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