Hyatt Hotels are using algorithmic Rest “smoking detectors” • Hacker News Board

Re: Hyatt Hotels are using algorithmic Rest “smoking detectors”

#401

Post by FireBeyond » Sat, Jul 19, 2025, 9:59 PM UTC

vitus wrote: post #294

FireBeyond wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> A person outputs about 1kg of CO2 per day, which is less than 1 gram per minute. I'm skeptical about this. Normal adult tidal volume is about 500mg, with a normal respiratory rate of 12/min, so 6L/min. Normal air is about 0.05% CO2, so you're at 3 grams/minute atmospherically that is inspired and expired. We actually output closer to 4% CO2. 240ml/minute. With the windows and doors closed in my 10x20 living space a…

You're mixing your units -- 0.05% of 6L is 3mL. In order for that to weigh 3g, atmospheric CO2 would have to be as dense as water. Most figures I see peg 1mL of CO2 at closer to 2mg (it's about 50% heavier than the equivalent atmospheric volume, since that's mostly N2 with some O2). Your estimate of 240 mL / minute is about 346L per day, or about 700g of CO2. That's roughly the same order of magnitude as the cited 1…

You're absolutely right, I apologize - I did mix units, and my thoughts collapse from there.

Re: Hyatt Hotels are using algorithmic Rest “smoking detectors”

#402

Post by chrismsimpson » Sat, Jul 19, 2025, 10:01 PM UTC

lxgr wrote: post #132

There has got to be a way to penalize companies for attempting this kind of thing. Even just removing the charge without discussion isn't enough, as some people will be traveling on a corporate card they don't necessarily monitor closely, will confuse the charge for something else etc. Otherwise, I'd love to be able to preemptively and without any prior communication charge (way in excess of the room rate, of course!…

Yeah, it’s called regulation and consumer protection.

Re: Hyatt Hotels are using algorithmic Rest “smoking detectors”

#403

Post by bluGill » Sat, Jul 19, 2025, 10:05 PM UTC

dreamcompiler wrote: post #247

grishka wrote: post #216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do hotels in the US not allow you to pay with cash any more? What if you don't have an internationally accepted card?

30 years ago it was possible to check into a good US hotel with cash under an assumed name. That is pretty much impossible now; they want to see your ID and a credit card. It might still be possible to pay cash in fleabag hotels; I don't know.

Try 60 years ago. I'm not sure when the change happened but 30 years ago cards were required. In 60+ year old books it is common for the 'dective' to look in the hotel book and find a false name.

Re: Hyatt Hotels are using algorithmic Rest “smoking detectors”

#404

Post by MichaelZuo » Sat, Jul 19, 2025, 10:05 PM UTC

photonthug wrote: post #188

DudeOpotomus wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is what actually kills brands. The funny thing is our collective memory is short, so a brand killed by poor product and bad decisions is often revitalized by PE a few years later, because of brand recognition.

Actually I think the public tends to generalize their complaints/injuries and act in the most spiteful ways that are available to them. For example, decades of bad experiences at the DMV translates into cries that we should defund the post-office, NSF, etc, no matter how irrational that is. But capital has a playbook now that's pretty effective at dodging this kind of backlash, like the "advertising without signal" t…

The only reason any businesses using tricks can get away with it, for any significant time, is because their customers rather pay less and endure some tricks than pay more to the honest upright folks elsewhere.

So it’s the customers themselves intentionally seeking out less than completely honest businesses to spend their money at because it’s X% cheaper.

Hyatt is typically considered an above average chain but I don’t think any HN reader would have thought them to be 100% honest and straightforward in 100% of locations.

Re: Hyatt Hotels are using algorithmic Rest “smoking detectors”

#405

Post by FireBeyond » Sat, Jul 19, 2025, 10:07 PM UTC

pixl97 wrote: post #171

FireBeyond wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I had friends whose landlord attempted to charge them cleaning fees for an apartment that they were renovating down to the studs (and had told them that, etc. They'd been working through the complex. They had to go to small claims. You can't claim a repair fee for some scratches and dents in drywall that you had crowbarred out the day after vacation of the property.

Always take full pictures of a unit the day you move in before any items are in, and the day you move out after cleaning. That's already saved me once when a property manager tried to do this to us.

Hah, an apartment complex I was at had me go sit in the PM's office prior to our move out inspection. "She'll be with you in a minute". Without snooping (I just caught my name on a form on her desk out of the corner of my eye), I noticed that it was my move out inspection form.

It already had remarks on it like "blinds dirty, need professional cleaning", "scuffs on drywall, needs painting", "carpet stains, need professional cleaning".

Huh.

She comes in, grabs the paperwork from her desk and says "Alright, let's do this". "Actually, I couldn't help but notice you'd already started charging me for things before we've even inspected the apartment". Cue some stammering. "Oh... uhh... that's strange. That must have already been on the form when I copied it from someone else's" (Oh, really, the printed form with my info with blue pen writing?).

And then there was the time that I needed a six month lease, but the PM company didn't want to do less than 12. I said "what it I pay the six months in full, up front, and the lease has no extension, so you know that I'll be gone and you can be planning for the next tenant in advance?". They talk to the owner, sure, that will work. I write a check for $14,000, six months rent at $2,000/mo, plus a security deposit. "That will be $18,000, actually." Huh? "We also need first and last month." Uhhh, what? It took far too long to explain to them that they were getting first, last, and the intermediary in the form of $12K. And got the distinct impression, from the stubborn inability to "comprehend" and "explain" that they thought that I wouldn't question it and just hand over another $4,000.

Re: Hyatt Hotels are using algorithmic Rest “smoking detectors”

#406

Post by pksebben » Sat, Jul 19, 2025, 10:17 PM UTC

scoofy wrote: post #392

pksebben wrote: post #386

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In what way is this country ruled by the people? You're periodically given a non-choice between two options that have equal disdain for your actual concerns, who then go on to play games to see who can get the most bajiliionare backing for reelection, and if you don't like what they're doing you're perfectly free to vote for the OTHER jerk who also doesn't give a shit about you. This is oligarchy. The 'democratic' pr…

Oh, god, this tired nonsense. Yes, obviously, it's ruled by the people. We have parties, we vote, anyone can run for office. Anyone can vote third party, and they occasionally even win. That your neighbors don't share your views does not make it undemocratic. It's not perfect, but it's democratic. It's like people can no longer imagine living under a totalitarian state... where you don't even get a vote, and if you d…

So we ought to be thankful we're not in NK. Got it. Glad your bar is so high. It's apparent that you're decided but other folks will read this so let's break it down barney style.

The 'third parties' argument is a painful joke, statistically speaking [0 1 2]. You can make all sorts of arguments as to why but the fact is that without support from D or R you can go get fucked.

This raises the question - are there only two opinions? With the obvious answer - of course not. We could say 'well, maybe people fall generally into two camps', but that doesn't really pass muster either, does it? I have friends on both sides of the aisle and I agree with all of them on some things. This is evidenced by the amount of voters registered third party despite the abysmal election numbers [3].

So what's going on here? Well, people are being strategic. We're on first-past-the-post in most places. This means you're typically voting not for what you want but for what you don't want. That is not a system of representation, it's a sports game where the prize is some cosmetic social program changes and not much else.

Mamdani is an excellent example of what this system does to third party candidates. As soon as there's a legitimate threat to the entrenched parties, fundraising spikes massively for the opposition [4].

Not getting a vote under this system wouldn't be more totalitarian, it would be more honest.

0 -https://pressgallery.house.gov/member-data/party-breakdown

1 - https://www.senate.gov/senators/SenatorsRepresentingThirdorM...

2 - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third-party_and_independent_me...

3 - https://usafacts.org/articles/how-many-voters-have-a-party-a...

4 - https://www.nytimes.com/2025/07/16/nyregion/mamdani-adams-do...

Re: Hyatt Hotels are using algorithmic Rest “smoking detectors”

#407

Post by mmmpetrichor » Sat, Jul 19, 2025, 10:19 PM UTC

It would be cool if we had real journalism these days instead of having to find these type of reports on social media.

Re: Hyatt Hotels are using algorithmic Rest “smoking detectors”

#408

Post by dboreham » Sat, Jul 19, 2025, 10:21 PM UTC

scoofy wrote: post #392

pksebben wrote: post #386

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In what way is this country ruled by the people? You're periodically given a non-choice between two options that have equal disdain for your actual concerns, who then go on to play games to see who can get the most bajiliionare backing for reelection, and if you don't like what they're doing you're perfectly free to vote for the OTHER jerk who also doesn't give a shit about you. This is oligarchy. The 'democratic' pr…

Oh, god, this tired nonsense. Yes, obviously, it's ruled by the people. We have parties, we vote, anyone can run for office. Anyone can vote third party, and they occasionally even win. That your neighbors don't share your views does not make it undemocratic. It's not perfect, but it's democratic. It's like people can no longer imagine living under a totalitarian state... where you don't even get a vote, and if you d…

> totalitarian state... where you don't even get a vote

Quick note that totalitarian states often have elections in which the population is allowed to vote.

Re: Hyatt Hotels are using algorithmic Rest “smoking detectors”

#409

Post by WaxProlix » Sat, Jul 19, 2025, 10:24 PM UTC

lxgr wrote: post #321

sixothree wrote: post #269

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because that's where you job books when you travel?

Then that sounds like the employers problem, though. Hopefully they audit their expense accounts for stunts like that.

So they check the bill and see that you incurred a $500 fine for smoking in the room they paid for? How does this help :(

Re: Hyatt Hotels are using algorithmic Rest “smoking detectors”

#410

Post by spuz » Sat, Jul 19, 2025, 10:32 PM UTC

tushar-r wrote: post #316

I'll probably pay 10 - 20% more for an "old school" hotel room with a clock radio and standard phone to call the front desk. No other "non-essential" electronics other than multiple well-placed power points. No TV, Coffee Machine either. The number of bright screens on random "smart" controls that I'm trying very hard to hide before sleeping are too much.

And you will because "entrepreneurial" chains like Hyatt will lower their prices thanks to the additional revenue they get from this and other unexpected charges in order to attract more customers.