Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

At Least 13 People Died by Suicide Amid U.K. Post Office Scandal, Report Says

nytimes.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

21–30 of 585 posts

Re: At Least 13 People Died by Suicide Amid U.K. Post Office Scandal, Report Says

#21

Post by neutronicus »

XCabbage wrote: post #6

[flagged]

I don't think there's any real danger of confusion. So I don't buy your objection on that basis.

I do think that both the suffix "-cide" and the transitive verb "committed" insinuate wrongdoing and I in fact appreciate avoiding that phrasing out of respect for the deceased and their families.

On the other hand my younger sister took her own life in 2014 and my uncle took his own life in 2017, and that's the phrasing I've used, whenever I've felt the need to share these biographical details. Doesn't discard their agency, but also doesn't stigmatize. I can't help but think that the style guide would be better served by this established vernacular. It's both clear and respectful, and I wouldn't even really call it a euphemism.

Re: At Least 13 People Died by Suicide Amid U.K. Post Office Scandal, Report Says

#22

Post by docdeek »

ellisv wrote: post #15
Horffupolde wrote: post #9

Suicide is a verb and result by itself. Would the author also say “he died by murder”?

They are simplify avoiding using the word "committed" using a well accepted alternative because of the connotation with criminal behavior. But no they would say "died by homicide" not "died by murder".

Would they not say "was killed" and so allow "killed himself/herself"?

Re: At Least 13 People Died by Suicide Amid U.K. Post Office Scandal, Report Says

#23

Post by bravesoul2 »

ignoramous wrote: post #5

Another post office operator, Seema Misra, was pregnant when she was sent to prison. She said in testimony that the local newspaper had published a photo of her and labeled her the "pregnant thief." While she was in prison, her husband was beaten up and subjected to racist insults, she testified. The tidal wave of fascist & far-right grievances are so hard to contain and fight against in the moment. Multi-cultural so…

At the moment yes but always has been in the UK.

Re: At Least 13 People Died by Suicide Amid U.K. Post Office Scandal, Report Says

#24

Post by lboc »

A good summary from the UK IT trade publication that broke the story:

https://www.computerweekly.com/feature/Post-Office-Horizon-s...

Not sure if this requires sign-in/subscription, so apologies in advance. I did neither and have access to the full article.

Re: At Least 13 People Died by Suicide Amid U.K. Post Office Scandal, Report Says

#25

Post by cjs_ac »

Horffupolde wrote: post #9

Suicide is a verb and result by itself. Would the author also say “he died by murder”?

This trend for commenting on news articles with nothing to say but a complaint about the wording of the headline is tedious. The right to free speech does not impose a responsibility to say something about everything you see.

Re: At Least 13 People Died by Suicide Amid U.K. Post Office Scandal, Report Says

#28

Post by squigz »

SirFatty wrote: post #16
mike_hearn wrote: post #8

To the NY Times: please don't say they died by suicide. The passive voice makes it sound like some act of God, something regrettable but unavoidable that just somehow happened. It's important not to sugarcoat what happened: the postmasters killed themselves because the British state was imprisoning them for crimes they didn't commit, based on evidence from a buggy financial accounting system. Don't blur the details o…

"The passive voice makes it sound like some act of God, something regrettable but unavoidable that just somehow happened. " That's a really odd take.

It's not that odd - it's simply pointing out that phrasing can and does play a rather large role in how we internalize and react to news.

Re: At Least 13 People Died by Suicide Amid U.K. Post Office Scandal, Report Says

#29

Post by thoroughburro »

SirFatty wrote: post #16
mike_hearn wrote: post #8

To the NY Times: please don't say they died by suicide. The passive voice makes it sound like some act of God, something regrettable but unavoidable that just somehow happened. It's important not to sugarcoat what happened: the postmasters killed themselves because the British state was imprisoning them for crimes they didn't commit, based on evidence from a buggy financial accounting system. Don't blur the details o…

"The passive voice makes it sound like some act of God, something regrettable but unavoidable that just somehow happened. " That's a really odd take.

It was an extremely common criticism of the passive voice. Yours is the weird take.
Post reply on HN