91–100 of 297 posts
God, the dark mode change reading is a blessing ! See https://drgrizz.xyz/dark-mode.html why
> So please fellow developers, help spread the darkness to make the world more inclusive. He ought to practice what he preaches. Due to a combo of shitty eyes and dyslexia, I cannot read his site's dark theme without getting a headache.
You can also read the site in reader mode.
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Well, I do think the thundebird team should investigate and fix this. But it is almost impossible to fix a bug you can't reproduce and have no clue why it might be happening.
> But it is almost impossible to fix a bug you can't reproduce and have no clue why it might be happening. No, not at all. It's very easy. This bug involves taking an inappropriate action under corrupted conditions. You don't need to know how those conditions arose. All you have to do is check whether they currently obtain, and - if so - refrain from taking the inappropriate action. For this bug, that looks like this…
Literally nothing stopping anyone in this thread from opening a PR with this reportedly “very easy” fix that’s eluded developers for nearly two decades, and is so terrible folks swear off Thunderbird forever because I guess for email very basic rules for backing up data don’t apply (or something?) and/or Gmail and Outlook are implicitly trustworthy?
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Well, I do think the thundebird team should investigate and fix this. But it is almost impossible to fix a bug you can't reproduce and have no clue why it might be happening.
> But it is almost impossible to fix a bug you can't reproduce and have no clue why it might be happening. No, not at all. It's very easy. This bug involves taking an inappropriate action under corrupted conditions. You don't need to know how those conditions arose. All you have to do is check whether they currently obtain, and - if so - refrain from taking the inappropriate action. For this bug, that looks like this…
I wanted to love Thunderbird, used it for years then a bug [0] literally deleted all my emails. I regularly see updates of people understandably raging on the ticket :( It's a bug that literally deletes user data from both the server and the client without warning. It's been open and confirmed for 17 years straight. It could happen to you. How is it not top 1 priority to fix it? [0] https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_…
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How do you fix a bug you can't reproduce? It's a genuine question because I'm puzzled here. A very small number of users have this bug (and tbf, it's a really bad bug), and are unable to consistently reproduce it and it seems none of the developers have been able to (the seemingly random nature of the bug occurring is not helping). How is it supposed to be fixed?
You add more and more diagnostics (e.g. logging) in that area till you manage to track down the bug. Over several years this should be possible. At that point you can either fix the bug directly or do it properly by first reproducing the bug (in a test) and then fixing it.
Said another way - If they can't reproduce it, they can't close it.
They may well have fixed it already, but without a way to reproduce it the only prudent behavior is to leave it open and wait for the next diagnostic file to be uploaded.
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Nitpick: not all bugs have to be reproducible to be taken seriously. Defensive programming, and adding extra logging could be a mitigation to avoid future problems, or to help fixing them in the future.
How do you fix a bug you can't reproduce?
The answer is that you keep working at it iteratively using a combination of logging, reporting, and defensive programming to systematically narrow down the possible causes. Sometimes you never arrive at a true root cause, but you get close enough that you can mitigate the problem and finally close the ticket out. At the end of the day, the customer/user doesn't care as long as it works.
However, what will really piss them off is telling them your hands are tied until they can reliably reproduce the issue for you. It's important they understand that you are working on it, and typically they will go out of their way to help solve the problem when they feel taken care of.
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See, you don't understand. Fixing the bug before reproducing it would violate the process .
How do you fix a bug you can't reproduce? It's a genuine question because I'm puzzled here. A very small number of users have this bug (and tbf, it's a really bad bug), and are unable to consistently reproduce it and it seems none of the developers have been able to (the seemingly random nature of the bug occurring is not helping). How is it supposed to be fixed?
I wanted to love Thunderbird, used it for years then a bug [0] literally deleted all my emails. I regularly see updates of people understandably raging on the ticket :( It's a bug that literally deletes user data from both the server and the client without warning. It's been open and confirmed for 17 years straight. It could happen to you. How is it not top 1 priority to fix it? [0] https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_…
Hopefully this prompted you to check your backups?
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I would not want my email client to be relying on such brittle and incorrect heuristics. A better workaround would be to keep deleted emails around for some time so users have the option to restore them if the bug triggers. But this has drawbacks such as potential privacy breakage (you meant to delete mails you don't want the chance that anybody sees it) or free disk space management (your local drive is overloaded a…
Just do a complete rewrite in rust, that will solve all the issues
>Experimental Exchange Support Natively set up a Microsoft Exchange account in Thunderbird by enabling a preference. Its cool that we don't need a third-party plugin for that anymore.