How does this differ from FireChat? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FireChat
Bitchat – A decentralized messaging app that works over Bluetooth mesh networks
71–80 of 457 posts
Re: Bitchat – A decentralized messaging app that works over Bluetooth mesh networks
#72Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'd much rather Apple allow running something like this (open source) myself rather than use their "just trust me bro" store.
I've never understood this argument. Apple spends billions of dollars vetting their store for high quality apps. You can't even verify the build you get off Github was compiled from the same posted source. As much as people want to be "leet" and run 3rd party software, it's inherently insecure and that's why Apple shuts it down.
You obviously build it yourself.
IMO ultimate solution is for Apple to curate some sort open source store where they vet the source and builds "in public".
Re: Bitchat – A decentralized messaging app that works over Bluetooth mesh networks
#73A bit different, as it's mainly for voice - but I made an app 'Murmur : Bluetooth Group Calls' - that lets you hold group voice calls and message via a mesh of Bluetooth LE connections. It's available on Android and iOS. https://apps.apple.com/gb/app/murmur-bluetooth-group-calls/i... Doesn't really get any downloads, so not sure there's much demand for this - but I use it with some shokz bone conducting headphones fo…
How's the range on BLE? I was looking at this app for exactly the use case you mentioned but was curious if it worked with varying distances on bike rides
It's somewhat device dependant - but between her Pixel 6 and my Pixel 7 - if we've got line of sight and the handset's not being held to our body (so in a handlebar mount or saddle bag) - 50-75m? I've been victim to the recent Microsoft layoffs, so have a bit of time to work on it at the moment - looking at adding longer range CodedPhy support this week (though that would only be available on Android)
It works best if there's 3 phones though - as it can route via the other if a link drops.
Re: Bitchat – A decentralized messaging app that works over Bluetooth mesh networks
#74Interesting try but Bluetooth LE is a non-starter when talking about building a truly decentralized mesh network at scale. The range isn’t there to build a network unless its very tight (in distance). You need sub MHz and eventually cubesats to build something robust, everything else is a toy.
How about HaLow?
Re: Bitchat – A decentralized messaging app that works over Bluetooth mesh networks
#75Earlier quoted context omitted.
Legit curious what the use case would be, that would justify Apple adding it in. Like, when do you need to text someone who's within Bluetooth range but somehow has no WiFi or cell reception?
On top of that “It would be so easy” is almost never true for a billion users network with all kinds of edge cases. Seems like a very narrow use case when there’s things missing from iMessage that could be way more appealing for a bigger group of users.
I’d agree if Airdrop, which includes offline identification via users’ address books, didn’t already exist. That seems to be by far the hardest part.
Re: Bitchat – A decentralized messaging app that works over Bluetooth mesh networks
#76Technical whitepaper: https://github.com/jackjackbits/bitchat/blob/main/WHITEPAPER...
Presumably that is the key to getting out of the Apple ghetto.
Re: Bitchat – A decentralized messaging app that works over Bluetooth mesh networks
#77Whoa this is really neat. I’ve been trying to get into Meshtastic but it’s hard to convince others when you need special hardware. Would be super neat if Apple did something similar. Shouldn’t be too hard since the AirTags use the same idea? Would also be neat if there was a way to build a LoRA proxy to extend the range. I might give this a try with my meshtastic devices.
It depends on the antenna efficiency of course, but I was surprised to discover that BLE modes around 128kbps using coded-PHY have a range extending over 1-1/2 km without a directional antenna. At 2.4ghz its line of sight, of course, but still…
That's extremely surprising to me too. I would have expected BLE to reach a few meters, not kilometers. How can I learn more?
Re: Bitchat – A decentralized messaging app that works over Bluetooth mesh networks
#78Interesting try but Bluetooth LE is a non-starter when talking about building a truly decentralized mesh network at scale. The range isn’t there to build a network unless its very tight (in distance). You need sub MHz and eventually cubesats to build something robust, everything else is a toy.
The big problem with BLE is the insane amounts of packet loss with extended advertising, even with perfect SNR many devices seem to just kind of not have the receive windows lined up right and drop 10% of packets. The range is perfectly good for a lot of applications where one might actually want to not use the internet, just not all of them.
Dropping 10% of packets sounds like a trivial problem to solve. That's not a range that requires fancy things like erasure coding or even SACK; it's easily handled by just retransmitting packets that don't get acknowledged.
Re: Bitchat – A decentralized messaging app that works over Bluetooth mesh networks
#79Very nice! Could this be published in the App Store, or does it use any APIs Apple considers off-limits? I'm regularly frustrated by modern phone's complete inabilities to allow any communication when outside of mobile network or Wi-Fi coverage, not even within the two large walled gardens. It would be so easy for Apple to extend iMessage to work peer-to-peer, at least between people that have already messaged each o…
Legit curious what the use case would be, that would justify Apple adding it in. Like, when do you need to text someone who's within Bluetooth range but somehow has no WiFi or cell reception?
Maybe you want to have a local conversation about Winnie the Pooh?
Re: Bitchat – A decentralized messaging app that works over Bluetooth mesh networks
#80Interesting try but Bluetooth LE is a non-starter when talking about building a truly decentralized mesh network at scale. The range isn’t there to build a network unless its very tight (in distance). You need sub MHz and eventually cubesats to build something robust, everything else is a toy.
Using the phone's RF modem itself would be the ideal choice. Why aren't there any userspace applications over this?