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Colombia seizes first unmanned narco-submarine with Starlink antenna

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Re: Colombia seizes first unmanned narco-submarine with Starlink antenna

#121
post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder how much of this is just a publicity stunt. Last time I dove deep into studying corruption in Latin America at University, Colombia was pretty much captive to the cartels. Hope it has gotten better now but I’m not sure if that’s the case given the massive Colombian diaspora that keeps increasing.

I just came across this podcast in the last week after wondering what ever happened to the FARC and AUC (right wing death squads) after the peace deal. How did things end up playing out relative compared to what was expected and feared at the time. It’s a pretty batshit story that focuses on what became of the right wing death squads (they run the start of the cocaine supply chain it turns out among many other things…

FARC was left-wing death squads; AUC far right counter-death squads.

Re: Colombia seizes first unmanned narco-submarine with Starlink antenna

#122

> No drugs were found That’s some level of confidence on the part of the Colombian military. I thought it was still customary to declare at least half otherwise nobody would believe you.

Some smuggling submarines are towed behind a boat. When the authorities stop the boat the smugglers cut the towing cable and sink the submarine.

Re: Colombia seizes first unmanned narco-submarine with Starlink antenna

#123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know we have data that shows just how harmful the war on drugs has been, but I'm curious if we have data showing that legalization in a modern society, with global supply chains and marketing campaigns, does not result in a bunch of people who previously wouldn't have done drugs - for fear of legal consequences, or just because they're hard to obtain - suddenly doing drugs. I'm genuinely interested to know, this is…

In most countries alcohol and tobacco are legal and widely available. They are both highly addictive and hazardous to health. And yet society mostly carries on, though we do lose some quantity of people to both of them.

I have a few reasons I might more willingly accept the legality of alcohol, I believe they're also the reasons prohibition didn't work:

1. Alcohol is deeply embedded in human culture, to get a significant portion of society to stop using it would be like trying to get people to stop eating bread or to stop having sex. It would be expensive and unproductive to enforce.

2. Alcohol is easy, though more dangerous, to make. To prohibit it would be to turn people towards more-dangerous moonshine.

3. Relatively speaking, alcohol's health effects aren't that bad; it's poison, but it's only very mild poison. Overindulging on alcohol once mostly leads to a hangover, it's difficult to drink enough alcohol to kill yourself and it starts to get unpleasant before you reach that point. The real dangers of alcohol seem to come with chronic use.

4. Alcohol is not extremely addictive. It seems most people can somewhat regularly partake without becoming alcoholics. In my understanding most addictive drugs won't get you hooked the very first time you try them, but trying them a few times is usually all it takes. Anecdotally, having used both, sometimes in excess, I find it much easier to resist a drink than nicotine.

If you pair these with the other harms and expenses of general drug prohibition (organized crime, disproportionate criminalization of minorities, etc) it becomes very hard to justify the prohibition of alcohol, in my mind.

Some of those things apply to tobacco too but to a lesser degree, so the case for illegalizing it might have some legs, although I suspect it's not worth it either. I might argue that burning tobacco products, specifically, should be illegalized due to the fact that there are several known, practical, and less destructive nicotine delivery methods. Lozenges, patches, and vapes work, and so far seem to be much less catastrophic for one's health. It's not clear to me that you'd get murderous tobacco cartels who lace their product with fentanyl.

Re: Colombia seizes first unmanned narco-submarine with Starlink antenna

#124
post #120

Why not make a solar-electric narcosub? That way you don't need fuel, and you're not relying on an IC engine with a bunch of moving parts, and that has a heat signature. The sun is shining in the ocean that these cartels are sailing in anyway, so there should be power. Steer with GPS, that way you are only listening. I wouldn't rely on Starlink, it seems like something that could be discovered easily. Any authority t…

Because solar panel math doesn't work. It's the same reason it makes no sense to put solar panels on a car: the solar panels would add minutes of driving daily. You would need massive area of solar panels to power a sub which is obviously not workable if you want to be stealthy.

But I'm thinking of a sub that is mostly just a solar panel. You don't need to be able to put a person in it? Don't you get a few hundred watts from a square meter?

Re: Colombia seizes first unmanned narco-submarine with Starlink antenna

#125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know we have data that shows just how harmful the war on drugs has been, but I'm curious if we have data showing that legalization in a modern society, with global supply chains and marketing campaigns, does not result in a bunch of people who previously wouldn't have done drugs - for fear of legal consequences, or just because they're hard to obtain - suddenly doing drugs. I'm genuinely interested to know, this is…

> "or just because they're hard to obtain " Are they? I have the feeling they are easier to obtain than if they were only sold at dedicated stores and teenagers had to show an ID, or similar to casinos addict trying to get out could ask to be put on ban list. Having said that, legalizing would not get rid of cartels, who are very diversified and also operate illegally on legal products by taxing producers and control…

At least in my circles I'd have a much harder time getting access to meth or heroin than I would a product that can be bought from a special store. I imagine there are many individuals like me, but I'm not sure, which is why I ask for data.

There's no doubt in my mind that addicts know how to find dealers, and don't have trouble finding new dealers when their former dealer gets arrested. What I'm worried about and asking for data about is the possibility of legalization creating a new cohort of addicts who would start to use hard drugs if they were to be as conveniently-obtained as liquor.

I'm not advocating for the war on drugs, to be clear, I'm dubious about treating hard drugs like alcohol, tobacco, or weed (in some states). I still lean towards decriminalization of possession and harm-reduction as being better policy, but I recognize it doesn't solve all the issues.

Re: Colombia seizes first unmanned narco-submarine with Starlink antenna

#126
post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because solar panel math doesn't work. It's the same reason it makes no sense to put solar panels on a car: the solar panels would add minutes of driving daily. You would need massive area of solar panels to power a sub which is obviously not workable if you want to be stealthy.

But I'm thinking of a sub that is mostly just a solar panel. You don't need to be able to put a person in it? Don't you get a few hundred watts from a square meter?

You need far more than a few hundred watts to move something in the open water, and these semi-submersibles aren't typically more than 30' vessels.

The math doesn't work out.

Re: Colombia seizes first unmanned narco-submarine with Starlink antenna

#127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They'll probably move onto mass producing weaponry, which, depending on the sophistication and scale, could be big issues for the rest of the world. They already partner with terrorist groups and other unsavory orgs as-is. Any group worth mentioning these days interfaces with the cartels

I don’t think weapon production is in their wheelhouse. Arms dealing maybe but not manufacturing. Facilities like those are permanent locations. Permanent locations tend to get raided and attacked. I think controlling municipalities like they are is working fine for them. No need to mass produce weapons when you can just buy them.

Where do you think this submersible was manufactured?

Re: Colombia seizes first unmanned narco-submarine with Starlink antenna

#128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know we have data that shows just how harmful the war on drugs has been, but I'm curious if we have data showing that legalization in a modern society, with global supply chains and marketing campaigns, does not result in a bunch of people who previously wouldn't have done drugs - for fear of legal consequences, or just because they're hard to obtain - suddenly doing drugs. I'm genuinely interested to know, this is…

When weed was illegal, buying weedeant calling a guy who also dealt in opiates and meth. When they didn't have weed, they'd try to upsell you on harder stuff. Now that I can get weed at a legit store, I have no clue where to get the harder stuff. My dozens of hookups have all left the field.

When I bought weed as a teen, I bought from all kinds of characters, but meth and opiates were never on the menu for me.

Re: Colombia seizes first unmanned narco-submarine with Starlink antenna

#129

Wrong antenna choice—should've used Starlink Mini to avoid motor damage from oscillation and salt exposure. Some suggest fiber optics instead of satellite comms, but these aren't submarines—they're boats, and autopilot technology is already reliable. Not sure why real-time communication is necessary; a "fire and forget" approach would suffice to reach the intended target.

Starlink dish does not require "leg" with motors for proper operation.

Re: Colombia seizes first unmanned narco-submarine with Starlink antenna

#130
post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s a space based data network, used for internet access.

Right I get that. Sorry my question wasn’t clear. But you could theoretically build a drone that would guide itself to a destination with just GPS right? It would potentially be even easier with water? Do you even need the two way command and control?

In theory, yes, in practice this probably requires engineering beyond what is available to these organizations (or the cost profile of the vessel.)

These aren't autonomous true submarines, they're semi-submersibles. Weather and surface conditions will vary (potentially greatly) along the route.

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