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Microsoft to Cut 9k Workers in Second Wave of Major Layoffs

bloomberg.com

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Re: Microsoft to Cut 9k Workers in Second Wave of Major Layoffs

#111

Post by triceratops »

wonderwonder wrote: post #58
idkwhattocallme wrote: post #9

For the most part, I'm indifferent to layoffs. Companies over hire and then course correct. It's part of the game. But for MSFT, it rubs me the wrong way. In the past 5 years, their stock has soared (150% on stock and doubled in valuation). They are insanely profitable ($82B profit). They are diverse (no existential business risk). The fact that they are unceremoniously laying off 30K of the people that helped them g…

The issue is they are laying off US workers and then importing Indian workers to replace them via 3rd party contractors. I saw a post on X today which essentially said "Ai will not replace your job, an Indian with Ai will replace your job" - this was posted by an Indian and he was completely right. Microsoft is actively laying off people with 150k salaries and replacing them with offshore workers earning a 10th of th…

How are they "importing" workers and still keeping them "offshore"?

Re: Microsoft to Cut 9k Workers in Second Wave of Major Layoffs

#112

Post by nly »

crmd wrote: post #41

Earlier in my career I worked for a tech industry-famous CEO who is long retired. One of the most unconventional things he taught me was that “our highest obligation is to employees and their families. Second is to investors. Third is to the communities we operate in. Obviously don’t ever say this in a board meeting or investor conference”. And he meant it. When products got cancelled, people got reassigned. Terminat…

Aren't most MSFT employees also shareholders thanks to stock awards?

Re: Microsoft to Cut 9k Workers in Second Wave of Major Layoffs

#113

Post by darth_avocado »

amendegree wrote: post #102
darth_avocado wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Hard to imagine all those H1Bs are so unique that others already employed can’t replace them. I think the language speaks for itself

Yes, it’s pretty clear that MS is abusing the H1B program. Which is supposed to be used only when no local talent can be found… if you’re firing 1000s of local people I have a hard time believing they are truly less skilled than the H1Bs being hired. Most engineers (H1Bs, and not) I’ve met aren’t exceptional. Saying that isn’t xenophobic.

They are firing people in the sales, gaming etc and the H1B hiring is in other orgs. AND the layoffs are global, not just in the US.

Re: Microsoft to Cut 9k Workers in Second Wave of Major Layoffs

#114

Post by ilove196884 »

symlinkk wrote: post #31
pratnala wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Layoffs are planned in India too.

Really? Where do you see that?

I am in India with friends in their last year in college. Hiring is effectively ice cold. Companies like TCS, Infosys wouldn't come to his college but now do. I just want to say good luck, these projects and products are on autopilot with no hiring in India and layoffs everywhere.

Re: Microsoft to Cut 9k Workers in Second Wave of Major Layoffs

#115

Post by mxuribe »

elcritch wrote: post #104

Given I’ve been trying to use some of Microsoft’s various productivity SaaS tools for a new job lately, and well, they need those workers. Teams is sort of tolerable now, but still feels terrible and lacks many of slacks niceties. The rest of their productivity stuff is terrible and slow. It’s embarrassing really. From what I read Azure is a border line dumpster fire. Then what LLM integration do they really have in…

Here's what i learned: the person buying software/services at many enterprises cares very little whether the thing being purchased is actually any good or not. They either pick based on some brand awareness (who doesn't know who IBM used to be, and who Microsoft is nowadays?), or they defer to someone else in the org...and that "some other senior leader person" in the org may or may not be the proper person to make the decision, etc....and then, the rest of the employees from said enterprise are stuck using something that very few might have chosen. Do i think there are good purchasers out there? Sure, but my direct experience is that the good ones are very few and far between sadly...and then momentum takes over in perpetuity.

And, then of course there's the "do as the competitors do", where when employees DO BRING UP good alternatives, the same aforementioned type of purchasers use the argument: "Well, lots of other firms and even our competitors use Microsoft...so why not stick with Microsoft...etc?"

Years ago, there used to be the phrase: "No one got fired for buying IBM...". I suppose nowadays you swap that brand out with "Microsoft", or "Google", etc. This rabbit hole goes really deep....but i encourage the interested to look up this IBM phrase, and you'll get tons of literature on why companies make purchasing decisions, and more importantly why they're often poor decisions.

Re: Microsoft to Cut 9k Workers in Second Wave of Major Layoffs

#116

Post by wonderwonder »

triceratops wrote: post #111
wonderwonder wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The issue is they are laying off US workers and then importing Indian workers to replace them via 3rd party contractors. I saw a post on X today which essentially said "Ai will not replace your job, an Indian with Ai will replace your job" - this was posted by an Indian and he was completely right. Microsoft is actively laying off people with 150k salaries and replacing them with offshore workers earning a 10th of th…

How are they "importing" workers and still keeping them "offshore"?

The are doing both friend. I am currently the last US employee on my project with a fortune 250 company. Started off with 60 devs. Half onshore, half offshore. Now I am the last on shore dev. Still 60 devs total

Re: Microsoft to Cut 9k Workers in Second Wave of Major Layoffs

#117

Post by sydbarrett74 »

idkwhattocallme wrote: post #9

For the most part, I'm indifferent to layoffs. Companies over hire and then course correct. It's part of the game. But for MSFT, it rubs me the wrong way. In the past 5 years, their stock has soared (150% on stock and doubled in valuation). They are insanely profitable ($82B profit). They are diverse (no existential business risk). The fact that they are unceremoniously laying off 30K of the people that helped them g…

Unfortunately, none of this matters to Wall Street, which wants eternal profit growth.

Re: Microsoft to Cut 9k Workers in Second Wave of Major Layoffs

#118

Post by mxuribe »

TurkishPoptart wrote: post #93

American employees are, for the most part, being replaced by H1-B visaholders via off-shore contracting companies. This needs to change.

> American employees are, for the most part, being replaced by H1-B visaholders via off-shore contracting companies...

American companies have been trying to replace American works for decades....this is not new. I wonder if trying to stop folks trying to make a simple decent living in the U.s. is not the right approach? ...Rather, i think the focus should be against the leaders of the American companies...Because they seem to be the ones pushing to get rid of ALL workers...sure, for now, they're trying to replace American workers, but soon enough they'll want to get rid of the H1B workers too...and eventually get rid of ANY/ALL workers if it means they can squeeze as much money for themselves.

If/When AI and robots come en masse to "steal jobs", would you blame the workers who get kicked out of the companies (even if they had upskilled themselves), or would you blame the leaders who kicked the people out? With all due respect, my opinion is that i think you're blaming the wrong people.

Re: Microsoft to Cut 9k Workers in Second Wave of Major Layoffs

#119

Post by Eggs-n-Jakey »

idkwhattocallme wrote: post #9

For the most part, I'm indifferent to layoffs. Companies over hire and then course correct. It's part of the game. But for MSFT, it rubs me the wrong way. In the past 5 years, their stock has soared (150% on stock and doubled in valuation). They are insanely profitable ($82B profit). They are diverse (no existential business risk). The fact that they are unceremoniously laying off 30K of the people that helped them g…

it's not even that man, it shows insecurity in their growth and future business, they're terrified they took the wrong bet on their massive investments into Ai, or the perception of those investments.

A layoff is a complete and utter failure in leadership top down.

Then applying for 6k visas that are going to be compensated well below industry levels is just a complete joke.

Re: Microsoft to Cut 9k Workers in Second Wave of Major Layoffs

#120

Post by rl1987 »

crmd wrote: post #35

I don’t remember when it became normalized for profitable companies to casually execute major layoffs. It used to be a “shameful” last resort that CEOs turned to as a last ditch effort to save a company facing bankruptcy. I suspect it’s related to the stock buyback safe harbor rule (Rule 10b-18.) Layoff announcements used to be a sign of a company in crisis, now the stock price often immediately rises, perhaps becaus…

Twitter layoffs of 2022 might have been the Lehman Brothers moment that marked the end of programming gold rush.
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