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Microsoft to Cut 9k Workers in Second Wave of Major Layoffs

bloomberg.com

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Re: Microsoft to Cut 9k Workers in Second Wave of Major Layoffs

#91

Post by sylens »

anonymousab wrote: post #86
tjpnz wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Their pivot to a marketplace model where their games run everywhere is an admission that they lost the race to Sony. Don Mattrick has a lot to answer for. Microsoft was killing it during the seventh generation and he was able to burn everything down over a period of two days. Xbox never recovered after that.

Don Mattrick isn't the reason that so many Microsoft studios have repeatedly shipped poor products or failed to ship at all over the past decade. Don Mattrick isn't the reason reason that Microsoft still seems to have the worst taste-testers in the industry. Don Mattrick isn't the reason that internal studios like 343 have messed up 18/6 requirements. Don Mattrick isn't the reason that Microsoft kept acquiring, messi…

Both are true.

Mattrick's missteps were not just about two days of revealing the XBox One, but really the entire second half of the 360's lifespan. The focus on Kinect to chase the Wii audience and the shuttering of many of their development studios left them thin on the exclusive front, which became a huge liability as they transitioned to the next generation.

But Spencer has a lot to answer for. He has been acquiring studios for 7 years now with little to show for it besides Obsidian having prolific output. Game Pass is flat, Xbox Cloud is flat, and their hardware is being outsold by Sony month over month, year over year. They seem to be pivoting to "Play Anywhere" which feels like the first phase of a three phase plan to retreat to the moat of Windows, where they can use Steam's momentum to ensure that games will at least appear on the platform. He inherited a mess but has made plenty of his own mistakes as well.

Re: Microsoft to Cut 9k Workers in Second Wave of Major Layoffs

#92

Post by aeternum »

idkwhattocallme wrote: post #9

For the most part, I'm indifferent to layoffs. Companies over hire and then course correct. It's part of the game. But for MSFT, it rubs me the wrong way. In the past 5 years, their stock has soared (150% on stock and doubled in valuation). They are insanely profitable ($82B profit). They are diverse (no existential business risk). The fact that they are unceremoniously laying off 30K of the people that helped them g…

Not everyone wants to be "upleveled" which often actually means work on something completely different.

This idea that companies must be the social safety net is deeply flawed, you want companies to take risks on new business lines that may not pan out. That's how we get innovation. In order to have that, you must not heavily penalize taking those risks.

Re: Microsoft to Cut 9k Workers in Second Wave of Major Layoffs

#94

Post by jimt1234 »

idkwhattocallme wrote: post #9

For the most part, I'm indifferent to layoffs. Companies over hire and then course correct. It's part of the game. But for MSFT, it rubs me the wrong way. In the past 5 years, their stock has soared (150% on stock and doubled in valuation). They are insanely profitable ($82B profit). They are diverse (no existential business risk). The fact that they are unceremoniously laying off 30K of the people that helped them g…

I was raised in a union-supported household. I've posted about it on HN before, but the tl;dr is that I'm still conflicted because:

- Pro: My father only graduated high school, yet was able to support a middle-class family - a house, two cars, 3 children, healthcare, etc., all with his union trucking job. That is almost unheard of today.

- Con: My father often talked about the corruption, like work being throttled to meet only the minimum output requirements in the union contract, and guys just sitting around, playing cards for half-a-day because it only took them a few hours to meet the requirements. (And new guys would get "talked to" in the parking lot if they tried to do too much work.)

Re: Microsoft to Cut 9k Workers in Second Wave of Major Layoffs

#95

Post by OkayPhysicist »

999900000999 wrote: post #11
mjr00 wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

AI works as a smokescreen when doing product development layoffs, but you can't really use it for sales, which is still very human-to-human, or when canceling entire projects like they're doing in XBox Game Studios.

I knew this was coming when Microsoft brought Activision. As ex game industry I nearly started crying at the news. Mergers always lead to layoffs, games aren't doing great as they're not essential in an iffy economy. Microsoft is seeing the writing on the wall and cutting internal studios. It's much cheaper to just pay 3rd parties to release on Gamepass vs having to fund an entire games development. I don't think we…

I don't think consumer spending power is the limiter in the games space at the moment. They've simply run out of new customers.

The explosive growth of the gaming industry over the 90s-2010s was fueled by continuously unlocking new swathes of consumers. Games went from being for kids, to being for adults and kids, to people who would never consider themselves "gamers" with mobile, which in turn created the "whaling" industry of microtransaction fueled F2P. But there's only so many new, large groups of people with money. What we're seeing now is a correction, with growth estimates collapsing back down to what you'd expect from a mature industry.

Re: Microsoft to Cut 9k Workers in Second Wave of Major Layoffs

#96

Post by pseudosavant »

trollied wrote: post #73
pseudosavant wrote: post #36

Microsoft's most recent quarterly numbers, for those interested: - Revenue was $69.6 billion and increased 12% - Operating income was $31.7 billion and increased 17% (up 16% in constant currency) - Net income was $24.1 billion and increased 10% How can you justify needing layoffs when you made $24B in net income on $70B in revenue?? I guess $24B and a 10% YoY increase is almost failing?

The answer is shareholders.

It is like we need to find a "post stock market" capitalism? The stock market is kind of the original crypto scheme after-all. Capitalism doesn't require a stock market.

Re: Microsoft to Cut 9k Workers in Second Wave of Major Layoffs

#97

Post by darth_avocado »

wonderwonder wrote: post #58
idkwhattocallme wrote: post #9

For the most part, I'm indifferent to layoffs. Companies over hire and then course correct. It's part of the game. But for MSFT, it rubs me the wrong way. In the past 5 years, their stock has soared (150% on stock and doubled in valuation). They are insanely profitable ($82B profit). They are diverse (no existential business risk). The fact that they are unceremoniously laying off 30K of the people that helped them g…

The issue is they are laying off US workers and then importing Indian workers to replace them via 3rd party contractors. I saw a post on X today which essentially said "Ai will not replace your job, an Indian with Ai will replace your job" - this was posted by an Indian and he was completely right. Microsoft is actively laying off people with 150k salaries and replacing them with offshore workers earning a 10th of th…

> Microsoft is actively laying off people with 150k salaries and replacing them with offshore workers earning a 10th of the salary.

I know the talking points on HN like to portray Indian developers as cheap, low quality labor, but contrary to popular belief, they aren’t getting workers for $15k. A Median senior developer earns almost $90k in India in Microsoft.

https://www.levels.fyi/companies/microsoft/salaries/software...

Re: Microsoft to Cut 9k Workers in Second Wave of Major Layoffs

#98

Post by ActionHank »

MangoToupe wrote: post #69
amendegree wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not to hate on immigrants… but shouldn’t H1B’s be the first on the chopping block of layoffs? Hard to imagine all those H1Bs are so unique that others already employed can’t replace them.

You don't need to pay H1Bs as much. They're a bargain deal.

They also can't as easily job hop.

Re: Microsoft to Cut 9k Workers in Second Wave of Major Layoffs

#99

Post by ActionHank »

strict9 wrote: post #3

Surprisingly no mention of AI in an article about mass layoffs at a tech company. Wonder if that line has finally had all the juice squeezed from it to explain away layoffs and outsourcing.

They've all done so many layoffs that they've realised there is no need to give the public a reason anymore, they don't need a scapegoat.

Re: Microsoft to Cut 9k Workers in Second Wave of Major Layoffs

#100

Post by runjake »

0cf8612b2e1e wrote: post #40
atomicnumber3 wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also, if it were actually about "low performers", this wouldn't be in the news. They'd just be terminated during/before perf review.

Eh, it can take a lot of political willpower to actually get rid of a low performer. We had an infamous case where it took two years to finally kick some deadweight to the curb. Wanted multiple years of underperforming performance reviews, I guess. Despite what some may claim about market efficiency, this is a public, wildly profitable company, not government. Unfortunately, I have never seen a layoff only remove wea…

We had a case where it took 10 years to cut 3 FTE deadweights and it only happened because of the 2008 Crash and consequential tightening of money flow.
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