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There are no new ideas in AI, only new datasets

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Re: There are no new ideas in AI, only new datasets

#41

Post by YokoZar »

EternalFury wrote: post #30

What John Carmack is exploring is pretty revealing. Train models to play 2D video games to a superhuman level, then ask them to play a level they have not seen before or another 2D video game they have not seen before. The transfer function is negative. So, in my definition, no intelligence has been developed, only expertise in a narrow set of tasks. It’s apparently much easier to scare the masses with visions of ASI…

I wonder if this is a case of overfitting from allowing the model to grow too large, and if you might cajole it into learning more generic heuristics by putting some constraints on it.

It sounds like the "best" AI without constraint would just be something like a replay of a record speedrun rather than a smaller set of heuristics of getting through a game, though the latter is clearly much more important with unseen content.

Re: There are no new ideas in AI, only new datasets

#42

Post by [deleted] »

EternalFury wrote: post #30

What John Carmack is exploring is pretty revealing. Train models to play 2D video games to a superhuman level, then ask them to play a level they have not seen before or another 2D video game they have not seen before. The transfer function is negative. So, in my definition, no intelligence has been developed, only expertise in a narrow set of tasks. It’s apparently much easier to scare the masses with visions of ASI…

[deleted]

Re: There are no new ideas in AI, only new datasets

#43

Post by cheevly »

Kapura wrote: post #31

Here's an idea: make the AIs consistent at doing things computers are good at. Here's an anecdote from a friend who's living in Japan: > i used chatgpt for the first time today and have some lite rage if you wanna hear it. tldr it wasnt correct. i thought of one simple task that it should be good at and it couldnt do that. > (The kangxi radicals are neatly in order in unicode so you can just ++ thru em. The cjks are…

Many of us have solved this with internal tooling that has not yet been shared or released to the public.

Re: There are no new ideas in AI, only new datasets

#44

Post by jdgoesmarching »

skydhash wrote: post #24
voxleone wrote: post #16

I'd say with confidence: we're living in the early days. AI has made jaw-dropping progress in two major domains: language and vision. With large language models (LLMs) like GPT-4 and Claude, and vision models like CLIP and DALL·E, we've seen machines that can generate poetry, write code, describe photos, and even hold eerily humanlike conversations. But as impressive as this is, it’s easy to lose sight of the bigger…

Yeah, but are there new ideas or only wishes?

It’s pure magical thinking that would be correctly dismissed if it didn’t have AI attached to it. Imagine talking this way about anything else.

“We’ve barely scratched the surface with Rust, so far we’re only focused on code and haven’t even explored building mansions or ending world hunger”

Re: There are no new ideas in AI, only new datasets

#45

Post by fsmv »

NBJack wrote: post #40
tough wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the problem is we train models to pattern match, not to learn or reason about world models

In other words, they learn the game, not how to play games .

They memorize the answers not the process to arrive at answers

Re: There are no new ideas in AI, only new datasets

#46

Post by moralestapia »

EternalFury wrote: post #30

What John Carmack is exploring is pretty revealing. Train models to play 2D video games to a superhuman level, then ask them to play a level they have not seen before or another 2D video game they have not seen before. The transfer function is negative. So, in my definition, no intelligence has been developed, only expertise in a narrow set of tasks. It’s apparently much easier to scare the masses with visions of ASI…

I wonder how much performance decreases if they just use slightly modified versions of the same game. Like a different color scheme, or a couple different sprites.

Re: There are no new ideas in AI, only new datasets

#48

Post by vladimirralev »

EternalFury wrote: post #30

What John Carmack is exploring is pretty revealing. Train models to play 2D video games to a superhuman level, then ask them to play a level they have not seen before or another 2D video game they have not seen before. The transfer function is negative. So, in my definition, no intelligence has been developed, only expertise in a narrow set of tasks. It’s apparently much easier to scare the masses with visions of ASI…

He is not using appropriate models for this conclusion and neither is he using state of the art models in this research and moreover he doesn't have an expensive foundational model to build upon for 2d games. It's just a fun project.

A serious attempt at video/vision would involve some probabilistic latent space that can be noised in ways that make sense for games in general. I think veo3 proves that ai can generalize 2d and even 3d games, generating a video under prompt constraints is basically playing a game. I think you could prompt veo3 to play any game for a few seconds and it will generally make sense even though it is not fine tuned.

Re: There are no new ideas in AI, only new datasets

#49

Post by stevep98 »

alfalfasprout wrote: post #12
jschveibinz wrote: post #7

I will respectfully disagree. All "new" ideas come from old ideas. AI is a tool to access old ideas with speed and with new perspectives that hasn't been available up until now. Innovation is in the cracks: recognition of holes, intersections, tangents, etc. on old ideas. It has bent said that innovation is done on the shoulders of giants. So AI can be an express elevator up to an army of giant's shoulders? It all de…

Access old ideas? Yes. With new perspectives? Not necessarily. An LLM may be able to assist in interpreting data with new perspectives but in practice they're still fairly bad at greenfield work. As with most things, the truth lies somewhere in the middle. LLMs can be helpful as a way of accelerating certain kinds and certain aspects of research but not others.

> Access old ideas? Yes. With new perspectives?

I wonder if we can mine patent databases for old ideas that never worked out in the past, but now are more useful. Perhaps due to modern machining or newer materials or just new applications of the idea.

Re: There are no new ideas in AI, only new datasets

#50

Post by IshKebab »

NBJack wrote: post #40
tough wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the problem is we train models to pattern match, not to learn or reason about world models

In other words, they learn the game, not how to play games .

Well yeah... If you only ever played one game in your life you would probably be pretty shit at other games too. This does not seem very revealing to me.
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