Live data from Hacker News

As AI kills search traffic, Google launches Offerwall to boost publisher revenue

techcrunch.com

21–30 of 112 posts

Re: As AI kills search traffic, Google launches Offerwall to boost publisher revenue

#21

Is it only me who feels its incredibly unfair for publishers, that not only did big tech trained their LLMs on free content authored by these publishers, but it's also killing their future revenue. It's like stealing from someone and then making sure they never make money again.

Yes it's unfair. It's digital colonialism. What's sad is that other companies keep falling for the false narrative that big tech monopolies act as partners and not the blood sucking leeches they've become to represent.

Re: As AI kills search traffic, Google launches Offerwall to boost publisher revenue

#22
post #18

Is it only me who feels its incredibly unfair for publishers, that not only did big tech trained their LLMs on free content authored by these publishers, but it's also killing their future revenue. It's like stealing from someone and then making sure they never make money again.

I'll be the voice of dissent. I don't think it's unfair. 1. I don't believe that training LLMs on publicly-available content is morally bad. Nor do I believe that it should be prosecutable as copyright infringement, any more than I believe that we should prosecute humans for studying books/art/essays/movies/etc and "downloading" that information into their brains. I'm not a big fan of IP law in general (I think it's…

Counter argument: part of why consumers have received so much value is that IP laws have encouraged inventors and creators to share their creations while maintaining rights. With those rights effectively eroded by training with genai, wouldn’t those group of creators share less and monetize in secrecy?

Re: As AI kills search traffic, Google launches Offerwall to boost publisher revenue

#23

Is it only me who feels its incredibly unfair for publishers, that not only did big tech trained their LLMs on free content authored by these publishers, but it's also killing their future revenue. It's like stealing from someone and then making sure they never make money again.

It's kinda an obvious solution: If people do get used to paying for ChatGPT like AIs (big "if"), then AI providers will start paying from their revenue for fresh new quality content. This would be great (if you don't like ads).

Re: As AI kills search traffic, Google launches Offerwall to boost publisher revenue

#24

Is it only me who feels its incredibly unfair for publishers, that not only did big tech trained their LLMs on free content authored by these publishers, but it's also killing their future revenue. It's like stealing from someone and then making sure they never make money again.

Publishers ≠ authors.

[deleted]

Re: As AI kills search traffic, Google launches Offerwall to boost publisher revenue

#25

AI kills search traffic. Yes. OTOH good search - deep research - is one of the biggest productivity gains using AI.

Until they kill off the content providers who a) rely on that traffic and b) provide the raw material for the models, of course.

And put ads and sponsored results in the LLMs.

Re: As AI kills search traffic, Google launches Offerwall to boost publisher revenue

#26

Is it only me who feels its incredibly unfair for publishers, that not only did big tech trained their LLMs on free content authored by these publishers, but it's also killing their future revenue. It's like stealing from someone and then making sure they never make money again.

In some sense I agree. But I also think publishers have been complicit in providing a gradually worse experience, usually through SEO, for 10+ years. This has drowned out what most people would call "good/original content" - think small, independent bloggers. That big publishers might lose their shirts sounds like a good thing to me.

At the end of the day, they're subject to the same market forces. If the big publishers lose their shirts, that means small bloggers don't have any chance of making it big. The same market forces that make big publishers worse are going to squeeze smaller outfits and writers.

And I know some people are going to say how writers and news "don't deserve" to make money because they haven't sacrificed enough upon the altar of tech, hustle, and Silicon Valley - I don't really care. I think newspapers and writing in general losing out is a blow to society.

Re: As AI kills search traffic, Google launches Offerwall to boost publisher revenue

#27
The exciting thing about search engines becoming useless as a traffic source, is that small publishers and blogs will eventually learn to adopt old technologies to gain traffic: web rings and links sections.

This means if you like a blog, there could now be a way to organically discover other blogs similar to it, by following links across multiple sites.

Re: As AI kills search traffic, Google launches Offerwall to boost publisher revenue

#28

Is it only me who feels its incredibly unfair for publishers, that not only did big tech trained their LLMs on free content authored by these publishers, but it's also killing their future revenue. It's like stealing from someone and then making sure they never make money again.

Let's not forget that online publishing was dead on its feet before ChatGPT ever showed up. What really killed their revenue was zero barrier to entry, combined with social media monopolizing the attention of users. Every publisher fighting for smaller and smaller shares of attention with more and more outlets, leading to a race to the bottom.

> What really killed their revenue was zero barrier to entry, combined with social media monopolizing the attention of users.

Well, and intentional efforts by the major tech companies.

Like Facebook lying about video stats to push "pivot to video". https://www.niemanlab.org/2021/09/well-this-puts-a-nail-in-t...

"It turns out that the metrics that Facebook was using to measure engagement with news video were wrong, massively overestimating the amount of time that users spent consuming video ads. In 2019, Facebook settled a lawsuit with those advertisers, paying them $40 million (while admitting no wrongdoing). But it was too late for the publishers who’d already pivoted to Facebook video and then either made big cuts or shut down completely when it turned out people weren’t actually watching."

Re: As AI kills search traffic, Google launches Offerwall to boost publisher revenue

#29

Is it only me who feels its incredibly unfair for publishers, that not only did big tech trained their LLMs on free content authored by these publishers, but it's also killing their future revenue. It's like stealing from someone and then making sure they never make money again.

Yes it's unfair. It's digital colonialism. What's sad is that other companies keep falling for the false narrative that big tech monopolies act as partners and not the blood sucking leeches they've become to represent.

Competition in the free market is not colonialism. The capitalistic marketplace is meant to involve disruption. That's the entire point: new companies come along and out-compete and out-innovate older companies and business models. The consumer wins. This is not the same as invading countries and subjugating the inhabitants, who have a human right to a peaceful life. No business in a capitalistic marketplace has a "right" to continue enjoying profits and resist innovation.

Re: As AI kills search traffic, Google launches Offerwall to boost publisher revenue

#30

Is it only me who feels its incredibly unfair for publishers, that not only did big tech trained their LLMs on free content authored by these publishers, but it's also killing their future revenue. It's like stealing from someone and then making sure they never make money again.

Yes it's unfair. It's digital colonialism. What's sad is that other companies keep falling for the false narrative that big tech monopolies act as partners and not the blood sucking leeches they've become to represent.

The choices given are to die today or die tomorrow, no wonder most are accepting whatever money they can get.
Post reply on HN