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Framework Laptop 12 review

arstechnica.com

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201–210 of 398 posts

Re: Framework Laptop 12 review

#201

Post by pdimitar »

I dig this laptop a lot but two things have put me off:

1. No full AMD options. I don't trust Intel's thermals and performance for several years now. Maybe they have rebounded but I no longer care. For me it's "AMD or get away from me".

2. No backlit keyboard. There is no excuse for this in 2025! I can forgive a lot of things, lack of biometric auth included, but no backlit keyboard is a cardinal sin.

I don't care about price. At this point I am ready to pay extra for libre hardware that is 100% open/free source ready and even working best with it. I would easily pay Macbook prices for a machine. But going for Intel and for no backlit keyboard -- nope.

Hope somebody from Frame.Work is reading. AMD has better thermals! (Or had, a few years ago, again, haven't checked in a while.)

Re: Framework Laptop 12 review

#202

Post by 0000000000100 »

Our company bought about 4-5 Framework 13s, and boy were they a bad experience. All sorts of driver issues, random crashes, USB ports not working right, etc.

Just about all of them had some kind of issue, which is really fun when your PM has a USB port not work randomly.

Ended up going back to HP laptops, 30% cheaper for the same specs and they just work consistently.

Would love to hear a hobbyist perspective, Frameworks are not a good choice for a business but I would be interested to hear if the replaceable parts / ports provided value for someone. My gut feeling is that something that can't be replaced easily in the Frameworks will die and it'll just end up being cheaper to replace the whole laptop.

Re: Framework Laptop 12 review

#203

Post by rafaelmn »

nucleardog wrote: post #130

> A good laptop, but not a good value Where "value" is purely monetary, I think that pretty succinctly sums up my experience/views on the Framework product line. They make good laptops, but you can generally get more for fewer dollars. If you're shopping on price, you can probably just skip right over their entire product line. That doesn't mean that their offering doesn't have value. It has value has a vote with you…

Repairability sounds good in theory but in practice outside of two year warranty period I'm fine if I have to replace the device because of failure, but I got 4-5 out of most of my devices. Like my 2018 Intel MBP was the worst laptop in terms of thermals/battery etc. It's still going with a family member I handed it over to. I don't think I've had a laptop die on me in last 12 years of using laptops, I usually keep them around after upgrade or pass them off to family.

And the upgradable internals sound like more of a hassle than a benefit - especially since buying a different device will be cheaper and probably a better experience since they don't have to engineer for replaceability.

Theoretically you'd get the option to plug in stuff not available in other laptops like strix halo - but then they still don't offer that in laptops. So meh.

Re: Framework Laptop 12 review

#204

Post by Nextgrid »

paddy_m wrote: post #27

What do you all use for a modern web development machine. 16GB of ram is no longer enough, I will soon upgrade to a new MBA with 32GB, but I still fear that won't be enough. I was looking at the latest framework and you can get it with 96GB of ram for $2k, that's $3600-$3800 for a mac and it's a much larger mac than I want. A quick scan of Dell and Lenovo non workstation class laptops didn't show any with more than 3…

Since you mention "Docker VM" I'm assuming you're using a Mac?

If so my best advice is to not use Docker for day-to-day development; reverse-engineer the docker-compose.yml/etc and run what you'd run in containers locally.

As a web developer I've been getting away with doing this for almost a decade now. It's a one-time cost to review what containers the app needs and then map that to a native world (install Postgres/etc via homebrew, adjust the env vars, etc).

The only time I run Docker nowadays is when I actually need to work on the Dockerfile itself and need to test it locally.

Re: Framework Laptop 12 review

#205

Post by tcfhgj »

ashwinsundar wrote: post #96
paddy_m wrote: post #27

What do you all use for a modern web development machine. 16GB of ram is no longer enough, I will soon upgrade to a new MBA with 32GB, but I still fear that won't be enough. I was looking at the latest framework and you can get it with 96GB of ram for $2k, that's $3600-$3800 for a mac and it's a much larger mac than I want. A quick scan of Dell and Lenovo non workstation class laptops didn't show any with more than 3…

Uninstall Firefox and stop developing junk in Next.js or any other vendor-as-a-service frameworks Install htop/btop and be more conscious about what your machine is actually doing. Needing more than 32GB RAM to develop a website is absurd

Firefox is the only browser with manifest v2 support

Re: Framework Laptop 12 review

#207

Post by mmcnl »

theodric wrote: post #52

> "A sturdy, thoughtful, cute design that just can't compete in its price range." People will pay untold thousands for a Mac, but God forbid when a PC manufacturer charges more than $599 for a laptop. If you're whining about the price, Framework isn't made for you. Go buy that Acer that you really want. The Framework is Sam Vimes' expensive boots that are made to last[1], and I've happily paid in full to get a pair.…

MacBook Air and MacBook Pro actually have very competitive pricing, even if you take into account the expensive upgrades. I'd buy the Windows/Linux equivalent at the same price in a heartbeat.

Re: Framework Laptop 12 review

#208

Post by wffurr »

rfwhyte wrote: post #159

I'd be a lot more into Framework if they had come out with a single other GPU option than the Radeon 7700S that's been the only GPU option available since the brands launch. The 7800M and 7900M have both been out over a year or more, and Framework has made zero mention of when or even if those models would ever be available as upgrades for Framework devices. I don't even really play games, but for my video editing wo…

They already released several updated mainboards for the 13 and 16 with newer Intel and AMD chips.

Re: Framework Laptop 12 review

#209

Post by [deleted] »

nucleardog wrote: post #130

> A good laptop, but not a good value Where "value" is purely monetary, I think that pretty succinctly sums up my experience/views on the Framework product line. They make good laptops, but you can generally get more for fewer dollars. If you're shopping on price, you can probably just skip right over their entire product line. That doesn't mean that their offering doesn't have value. It has value has a vote with you…

[deleted]

Re: Framework Laptop 12 review

#210

Post by 0xTJ »

mmcnl wrote: post #186
nucleardog wrote: post #130

> A good laptop, but not a good value Where "value" is purely monetary, I think that pretty succinctly sums up my experience/views on the Framework product line. They make good laptops, but you can generally get more for fewer dollars. If you're shopping on price, you can probably just skip right over their entire product line. That doesn't mean that their offering doesn't have value. It has value has a vote with you…

I don't really understand the repairability appeal of the Framework. Hasn't that already been a selling point for the business line laptops of HP, Lenovo and Dell for years? They all offer premium business laptops with removable RAM, SSD and battery and very detailed maintenance guides. Part availability is good too.

While HP's service guides have been good, even on their non-business models, the actual serviceability isn't great. You have rubber feet that can't be re-applied after removal, and good luck getting replacement parts as an average consumer (I haven't even been able to get a first-party battery for my HP Envy x360). Not every laptop is going to a corporation with an IT department and direct procurement connections.

RAM, SSD, and battery are also the very minimum in terms of serviceability on a laptop, they've been traditionally user-serviceable. It's components like the touchpad, display, ribbon cables, etc. that haven't been traditionally easy/possible to replace.

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