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Accumulation of cognitive debt when using an AI assistant for essay writing task

arxiv.org

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Re: Accumulation of cognitive debt when using an AI assistant for essay writing task

#331

Post by arethuza »

khazhoux wrote: post #304
arethuza wrote: post #296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only two times I have made bad navigation mistakes in mountains were in the weeks after I started using my phone and a mapping app - the realisation that using my phone was making me worse at navigation was quite a shock at the time.

But you didn't become worse at navigation. Sounds like you trusted a tool, and it failed you.

No - on both occasions it was the same scenario - descending from a peak in bad weather and picking the wrong ridge to descend - I was confident I "knew" which was the right ridge and with the app I use bearings for the right route are pretty difficult to distinguish - so completely my fault.

I'm now aware of that problem and haven't had that problem since but I was pretty shocked in retrospect that I confidently headed off in the wrong direction when the tool I was using was by any objective measure much better.

I agree with this:

"the key to navigating successfully is being able to read and understand a map and how it relates to your surroundings"

https://www.mountaineering.scot/safety-and-skills/essential-...

Re: Accumulation of cognitive debt when using an AI assistant for essay writing task

#332

Post by xnorswap »

Etheryte wrote: post #316
DocTomoe wrote: post #306

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I like to think of AI as cars: You can go to the Walmart outside town on foot. And carry your stuff back. But it is much faster - and less exhaustive - to use the car. Which means you can spend more quality time on things you enjoy.

I think in a way this is a good analogy, because it also includes the downside. If you always drive everywhere and do everything by car, your health will suffer due to lack of physical activity.

And you'll randomly kill people on your way there.

( Of course dear reader, YOU won't randomly kill people because you're a "good driver". )

Re: Accumulation of cognitive debt when using an AI assistant for essay writing task

#333

Post by darkwater »

dyauspitr wrote: post #314
risyachka wrote: post #302

This is exactly why there is no point in using AI for coding unless in rare fee cases. Code without AI - sharp skills, your brain works and you come up with better solutions etc. Code with AI - skills decline after merely a week or two, you forget how to think and because of relying on AI for simpler and simpler tasks - your total output is less and worse that in you were to diy it.

My total output is definitely higher.

5 years from now, will you ability to explain or build from first principles on your own be increased, though?

Re: Accumulation of cognitive debt when using an AI assistant for essay writing task

#334

Post by isaacremuant »

Tool rots your brain alarmism, news at 11.

The claim "My geo spatial skills are attrophied due to use of Google maps" and yet I can use Google maps once to quickly find a good path, and go back next time without using. I can judge when the suggestions seem awkward and adjust.

Tools augment skills and you can use them for speedier success if you know what you're doing.

The people who need hand-held alarmism are mediocre.

Re: Accumulation of cognitive debt when using an AI assistant for essay writing task

#335

Post by alganet »

santiagobasulto wrote: post #308

Wasn't THE SAME said when Google came out? That we were not remembering things anymore and we were relying on Google? And also with cellphones before that (even the big dummy brickphones), that we were not remembering phone numbers anymore.

Their results support this. The study has three groups: LLM users, Search Engine users and Brain only.

In terms of connections made, Brain Only beats Search User, Search User beats LLM User.

So, yes. If those measured connections mean something, it's the same but worse.

Re: Accumulation of cognitive debt when using an AI assistant for essay writing task

#336

Post by matusp »

I wonder to what extent this is caused by the writing style LLMs have. They just love beating around the bush, repeat themselves, use fillers, etc. I often find it hard to find the signal in the noise, but I guess that it is inevitable with the way they work. I can easily imagine my brain shutting down when I have to parse this sort of output.

Re: Accumulation of cognitive debt when using an AI assistant for essay writing task

#337

Post by xixixao »

lm28469 wrote: post #328
DocTomoe wrote: post #306

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I like to think of AI as cars: You can go to the Walmart outside town on foot. And carry your stuff back. But it is much faster - and less exhaustive - to use the car. Which means you can spend more quality time on things you enjoy.

You got it backwards, there wouldn't be a walmart outside of town if there were no cars, you'd walk to the local butcher/baker/whatever in <10min.

Where you’d be able to afford much less (not judging the trade-off, but that’s the primary reason why the US is headed in the opposite direction).

Re: Accumulation of cognitive debt when using an AI assistant for essay writing task

#338

Post by gherkinnn »

chii wrote: post #321
gherkinnn wrote: post #313

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At the price of a sluggish, atrophied body.

which is why people now pay $100 a month for a gym membership.

Save an hour a day to spend it in the gym. That's what I call a bargain.

Re: Accumulation of cognitive debt when using an AI assistant for essay writing task

#339

Post by Terr_ »

bootsmann wrote: post #287
theodric wrote: post #280

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My guess, based on what's been found about somewhat better cognitive outcomes in aging in people who make an effort to remain fit and stimulated[1], is that we could see slightly worse cognitive outcomes in people that spent their lives steering an LLM to do the "cognitive cardio" rather than putting in the miles themselves. On the other hand, maybe abacuses and written language won't be the downfall of humanity, des…

> On the other hand, maybe abacuses and written language won't be the downfall of humanity, destroying our ability to hold numbers and memorize long passages of narrative, after all The abacus, the calculator and the book don't randomly get stuff wrong in 15% of cases though. We rely on calculators because they eclipse us in _any_ calculation, we rely on books because they store the stories permanently, but if I use…

> The abacus, the calculator and the book don't randomly get stuff wrong in 15% of cases though.

Yeah, you'd think that a profession that talks about stuff like "NP-Hard" and "unit tests" would be more sensitive to the distinction between (A) the work of providing a result versus (B) the amount of work necessary to verify it.

Re: Accumulation of cognitive debt when using an AI assistant for essay writing task

#340

Post by javierbg95 »

StopDisinfo910 wrote: post #324

This study is methodologically poor: only 18 people, SAT topics (so broad and pretty poor with the expectation of an American style “essay”), only 20 minutes of writing so far too little time to properly use the tool given to explore (be it search engine or LLM). With only 20 minutes, I’m not even trying to do a search. No surprise the people using LLM have zero recollection of what they wrote. Plus they spend ages d…

Quoting is actually extremely important. There's a big difference between making a certain claim a) because [1] performed an experiment that confirms it and [2] and [3] reproduced it and b) because the magic machine told me so.

This is still true whether or not the claim is true/accurate or not, as it allows for actual relevant and constructive critique of the work.

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